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Originally posted by JEC:
I haven't seen any offered by BuySoundtrax yet.

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Based on past sell-outs like this I suspect you won't. They will say that they didn't get enough to meet customer demand and it wouldn't be fair to sell to just a few customers so they will just ebay it for as much as they can get.

quote:

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Originally posted by MWRuger:
Based on past sell-outs like this I suspect you won't. They will say that they didn't get enough to meet customer demand and it wouldn't be fair to sell to just a few customers so they will just ebay it for as much as they can get.

Who knows maybe they will offer it to their best customers with only a 10 dollar markup. Weirder things have happened.

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Yup, weirder things have happened and wierder things continue to happen:

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INCHON available for $24.95 @ BUYSOUNDTRAX SPECIAL CONDITIONS WILL APPLY LIMITED QUANTITY AVAILABLE!!

INCHON
Original Soundtrack Recording-2 CD SET
Music by Jerry Goldsmith
$24.95
LIMITED TO ONE COPY PER CUSTOMER

PLEASE READ THE FOLLOWING VERY CAREFULLY BEFORE ORDERING!!!!

This 1500 unit 2-CD Limited Edition Collector's release of Jerry Goldsmith's INCHON sold out in less then a day after it was offered and we were lucky to get our order in just before it sold out...

We have decided to offer to any customer who purchases $100.00 or more of other merchandise (this amount excludes postage, handling or sales tax) one copy of this title for only $24.95 while our supply lasts.

We are doing this to reward our high volume customers who have been loyal to BUYSOUNDTRAXover the years.

In addition, we have lowered the prices on most VARESE SARABANDEsingle CDs to $14.95 and double CD sets to $19.95

We have also added a number of titles from VARESE and SONIC IMAGES to our bargain bin that you might wish to have a look at for under $9.95.

We hope this will give you the biggest "Bang For Your Buck" that we can give you!!!

Thank you for your time and support.

The Staff of Buysoundtrax.com

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So, basically, you're eligible to get a copy of Inchon if you go ahead and dump $100 bucks on them for other stuff. Otherwise nope, you can't have one. Nor can you, or you, or you. Sorry!

Well, whatever... Intrada isn't repressing them. I fell for it. Luckily I found some things I've been wanting... not that I was expecting to get them now, but whatever. Blah. Pardon me while I go cry in my pillow.

[Message edited by BigT1981 on 09-15-2006]

You can't get a more perfect example of what people do when greed and money rules their ethic. Just as Slestack pointed out, it's pretty abhorrent. Whether or not there's $100 worth of goods we want is not the point.

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Originally posted by PeterK:
I am shocked. People, come on. Supporting what BSX is doing only means they'll do it more in the future. You give them the OK by accepting this crap!

You can't get a more perfect example of what people do when greed and money rules their ethic. Just as Slestack pointed out, it's pretty abhorrent. Whether or not there's $100 worth of goods we want is not the point.

If most of you guys don't care about what BSX has done, that's cool. Maybe I'll do the same **** . But I personally hoped there would be an outcry and big boycott of this crap. It serves no one well, and only makes our troubles worse!

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I'm not happy about it and certainly don't think what BSX is doing is cool. That's why I posted it here, so everyone could be aware. I don't approve of it b/c not everyone can do what they're asking - it's unfair. Fortunately I was able to cheat the untimely misfortune of missing the Intrada pre-order. That doesn't mean I'm grateful to BSX for freakin' taking advantage of the situation and exploiting people like me. That said, I'm fighting my passion as a Goldsmith collector - and as a part of my order to BSX picked up several other Goldsmith titles I've been biding my time on.

I'm still unhappy w/ BSX's methods. Yes, they are unethical. Covering up their motives with BS like "We are doing this to reward our high volume customers who have been loyal to BUYSOUNDTRAX over the years" is chauvinistic and elitist toward an already very small community of film music lovers. It's stupid because I'm not a high volume customer that's been loyal to them "over the years." This was my FIRST order - EVER. That said, consider the source guys... and then ask yourselves - can this behavior really be changed?

Buysoundtrax -

If they really wanted to reward their long term, high volume customers they should just query their sales database and offer them privately via e-mail at the usual markup starting with the largest (non-dealer) buyer on the smallest until what they had was sold out.

They took a lot of heat for ebaying some Varese CD Club cds a while back and so they thought this would be more palatable while still letting them make a pile of stash. Regardless, they definitely have an image problem, stemming from many fans dislike of sales tactics to personal issues with the people involved in the operation.

I have said before that as long as fans continue to pay through the nose for these limited editions (that are only collectible because we make them so) then someone will take your money and these guys will continue the shellgame. I had a real hope that Intrada was going to give the speculators a black eye with a repressing but it was not to be.

Limited Editions

Now I am going to predict the future. Ready? Good.

Some label, probably Varese or Intrada, is going to release a limited edition that everyone really cares about. Maybe Alien. It will get snapped up in a day.

Fans will howl, to no avail. People will defend the practice in the name of capitalism and legality and tell everyone to stop whining that it is just a CD. People will call for limits on purchases and other arcane methods to insure that half of the next limited release doesn’t go to scalpers and hoarders. Messageboards will be abuzz with speculation and recrimination.

And none of it will make a bit of difference. Except in the minds of few fans who will have had enough. They will say to themselves:

“Self, I already have more music than I can easily listen to, do I really need this crap? Hanging around order sites til 3:00 AM to be sure I can get a release? Chasing “limited” editions that are no more limited than the 1st pressing the score ever had? Do I really need to spend 6 times the asking price for another CD that is going to get played a few times in filed just so I can say I have it? To hell with it, it’s just not fun anymore. I’ll just trade fir a CD-R. It sounds the same and doesn’t line the pockets of profiteers.”

And they will stop. They will stop buying. They will stop collecting. Over the course of a year or two limited editions will stop selling out, hell they will stop being profitable or even breakeven. Some beloved labels will probably belly up speculators will lose interest and move onto the next big thing, whatever it is.

What will be left is a niche market shrunk, even smaller with nothing new to revitalize it and no one willing to risk marketing an older score because look what happened the last time.

Maybe all that sounds far-fetched to you. Hell, you love film music and you won’t give it up. Maybe. But I am nearly there already. I have seriously thought of just ripping all my CD’s to high bitrate MP3s, burning backups of my mp3 archives and selling every score I own. My complete Varese, FSM and Intrada runs, all my Japanese imports, everything. Hell, about half the time I would rather listen to Rock anyway.

I no longer look forward to a release date with eagerness in hopes that something great and surprising will be released. Usually “What is this? Can I wait a few weeks to save on shipping? Do I really want this? I guess I better get it if I want it at all or I’ll have to pay a lot more later.” How thrilling.

Sure, a few things still interest. The Bernstein Collection was incredible. Really great music. Ghostbusters was a holy grail score for me. I waited 20+ years for a score release. But that’s only two issues in a flood of stuff and the current nastiness makes it taste like ashes in my mouth.

I definitely try to support MM as often as I can and feel personally connected because Peter's always been there for me.

At the same time, I do understand how some people will look in other directions to complete their library. And that's their free-market right too. I'm not going to wade into that debate.

quote:

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Originally posted by MWRuger:
Maybe all that sounds far-fetched to you. Hell, you love film music and you won’t give it up. Maybe. But I am nearly there already. I have seriously thought of just ripping all my CD’s to high bitrate MP3s, burning backups of my mp3 archives and selling every score I own. My complete Varese, FSM and Intrada runs, all my Japanese imports, everything. Hell, about half the time I would rather listen to Rock anyway.

I no longer look forward to a release date with eagerness in hopes that something great and surprising will be released. Usually “What is this? Can I wait a few weeks to save on shipping? Do I really want this? I guess I better get it if I want it at all or I’ll have to pay a lot more later.” How thrilling.

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quote:

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Originally posted by MWRuger:

I have seriously thought of just ripping all my CD’s to high bitrate MP3s, burning backups of my mp3 archives and selling every score I own. My complete Varese, FSM and Intrada runs, all my Japanese imports, everything. Hell, about half the time I would rather listen to Rock anyw

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How dare you consider listening to your film music in lossy format! MP3s are the devil. It's CDs or nothing for me!!

I feel very much the same way as you do. What are these things doing other than taking up a lot of space in my apartment?

Ryan

I said of BSX's "deal" that "it serves no one well, and only makes our troubles worse!"

Then MWRuger said it again, with lots more words and examples that make it relate much much more on the personal level. Thanks for that post, Michael.

A lot of my perspective comes as a retailer, which is something you don't see very much of in our niche. Yeah, playing the limited edition game by having to stay up so late and pressuring yourself into impulse buys is the quick way to burn out your collecting passion. But for me, I have decently-sized group of people who've come to rely on the service I've provided, and when I order only 30 copies instead of 50 or 100 copies of a limited edition and my pre-orders sell out as fast as the label's, I feel like I've lost because of those people I've had to say "no" to. As a retailer, this is a poor situation. Thankfully, a lot of customers understand, but it can be a sting to many, espectially those who love Jerry Goldsmith, and I feel somewhat of a responsibility for the failure.

Right now I have some rare out of print scores that have seen expanded releases that are now oop as well. I have been sitting on these for several years debating what to do with them. I will admit I sold one of them to someone who had been looking for it but didn't want to pay the normal eBay price for it. I sold it to him for $15.00 and prbably could have gotten another $30.00 to $40.00 on the open market.

It is so tempting to buy extra copies and maybe try and make some money back on my collection. Don't get me wrong I love film music and love listening to it more than any other type of music. Th night Inchon was released I had my friend over for dinner and he is a film score fan as well. When I went to Intrada's site to buy it I asked him if he wanted a copy because it was only 1500, he said he'd probably get it later. I told him good luck, but I came close to ordering another copy to have in case he changed his mind or if not I could sell it at a later date. But there is a part of me inside that puts myself in someone else's shoes and I realize for every copy I buy that deprives some other honest hardworking fan of the music.

I've come to relize that if I'm going to continue collecting film music I'm going to have to play the game and get up early to buy the Varese releases, check the web daily for Intrada's releases and act quickly when they are announced.

My fear is that one of these days Doug, Lukas and even Robert Townson at Varese are going to get fed up with all the bickering or realize that financially they would be better off doing something else and call it quits.

I find this particularly odd, considering the fact that as a customer, I did voluntarily enter my information into a secure online form, was asked to review my order before confirming my purchase, and then clicked the "place order" button on my own volition. I suppose that isn't enough these days to clearly spell out a person's intention to purchase a product!

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Hello,

Would like to cancel your order with us, it appears based on this post that you made at MOVIEMUSIC.COM you fell we have not treated you fairly by us.

We wouln't want you to feel that we forced you to do anything you didn't wish to or have to deal with "unethical" company.

Your order is on hold until we hear from you.

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Guys, I don't know about you, but there's something wrong with a company personally interfering with the progress of my order simply b/c I've decided to speak out in a public forum. I guess I should watch out, despite the fact I made my intention to purchase over $100 in product from BSX extremely clear.

For the record, I e-mailed BSX back requesting they not cancel my order. No reply. I then sent another e-mail asking for confirmation. No reply. After further thought and consideration, I sent a third e-mail thanking them for the opportunity to reconsider my order, and that yes, I would like to cancel. Instant reply: "No problem."

It's become increasingly apparent to me that ordering from BSX isn't simply a matter of handing over your money and then receiving said goods and services. It's a thick, gooey, highly political and subjective process that requires you be on your best behavior. The great eye is watching! Should you step out of line, your order will be placed on hold and your intentions as a paying customer will be questioned.

No thanks, BSX. Yet another example of how not to treat your customers.

You know I saw that they had the 2-CD Rhino/Warner Superman set (uncertain if they still have it because I don't bother to check) and I was contimplating buying it. Then I found it on Amazon through the new and used section. Same goes for the score The Final Countdown by John Scott.

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Originally posted by MWRuger:
Man! These guys must love bad press!

I can't help but wonder who actually wrote that note. The style sure seems familiar.

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Awww shucks, I was in the mood for a public flogging!!!

quote:

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Originally posted by Jeron:
And you know what, that's fine. Maybe I inaccurately profiled BSX as a company utilizing "unethical" methods. I apologize to them for that. It was a knee-jerk response that probably wasn't warranted. That said, I do whole-heartedly believe that it's UNFAIR to ask folks to spend a certain amount of money before they can qualify to purchase Inchon.

[Message edited by Jeron on 09-17-2006]

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Personally, I'd go with the first assessment. This is one of the most interesting threads I've read in a long time.

You might want to take a look at this:
http://www.filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.asp?threadID=36842&forumID=1

You're an official folk hero!