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      The Alamo...it's back, was new Howard/horner project

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    Topic:   The Alamo...it's back, was new Howard/horner project

     Marc Flake
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    The previous topic title no longer applies to the movie of this famous battle. For the latest info go to: http://www.dallasnews.com/latestnews/stories/112002dnmov1Aalamo.61d50.html

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    posted 11-20-2002 07:16 AM PT (US)     

     John C Winfrey
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    I have been hearing about this for a long time now. Its based on the book I read back in the '70s on the diary of one Enrique DeLa Pena, an officer with Santa Anna in the campaign in Texas. There was a great special about all this the other day on the History Channel and one a while back on Discovery and Learning Channel.

    I hope they show the real truth this time.

    All charges on final day between 4 and 6 AM
    three separate charges
    Bonham and Travis were childhood friends-Bonham came back the last time to the Alamo because of his friendship to Travis when he could have kept going
    "Moses" Louis Rose-left Alamo just before final battle-supposedly lived until 1880s and died in Nacogdoches. He was in Napoleon's Army in Russia and at Waterloo.

    at least two other messengers did not get back in time-a teen who left three days before end, and Dr. Sutherland who was on the way back when he heard it had fallen.

    Santa Anna was almost killed twice during the siege-once when he was inspecting a cannon emplacement on the side where the Tennesseeans were located. One of them fired at him from long range. He scurried for safety. The other time at end of battle around 545-600 AM he and the band were approaching the north wall thinking all were dead in mission. ONe man on north wall still alive, able to get up and fire one shot. It whistled over his head. He turned and retreated and waited awhile longer.

    Tennesseeans, Crockett or one of his men, picked off two Mexicans from long range getting water from a stream during the siege. They were about 200-300 yards from the mission when shot.

    5-7 were found hiding in the Long Barracks at end of battle. Some of them were Tennesseeans. One claimed to be Crockett and had a coonskin hat. This could of been one of his men pretending to be him. They were slaughtered. One general and colonel argued that they should be spared. Santa Anna would have none of that. They were torn apart by the men standing by when Santa Anna said "kill them."

    the diary is supported by letters of other officers there who wrote about some of the incidents later on.

    the book is called "In Texas with Santa Anna" published in 1975 University of Texas Press

    BEst, John. A Texan. History and geography teacher and I have read much since a kid on this. With all these poor Alamo movies over the years lets hope this one is more accurate.

    See ya.

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    posted 11-20-2002 01:39 PM PT (US)     

     Marc Flake
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    John wrote: "I hope they show the real truth this time." As opposed to the real myth?

    That's been the big problem with making an Alamo movie. People squawk if it relies too much on the myth and other people squawk if no myth at all is included. John Wayne did much to promulgate "The Myth" and as "The Myth," I really love his movie. I would like to see as historical a representation as possible this time around. As was said on the other topic on this movie, the people and event itself lend themselves to a great story without including the myth.

    I would be hesitant to base a movie on De La Pena's work, though. As you know, that diary hasn't yet been accepted as fact yet. There's still a lot of controversy over it.

    I would be interested to see if Alamo historian Stephen Hardin is involved in the project in any way. He could help keep them on track, historically.

    I read "Gates of the Alamo" last year. I thought then, and still think now, that it would make an excellent basis for a movie.

    I would hope that they include the Battle of San Jacinto. The one in the mini-series "James Mitchner's Texas" was horrible. To me, a movie about the Texas Revolution that focuses just on the Alamo is like a movie about Jesus that ends with the crucifiction.

    [Message edited by Marc Flake on 11-21-2002]

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    posted 11-21-2002 11:17 AM PT (US)     

     John C Winfrey
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    Marc, I also thought that Michener Texas TV show was awful. Really pitiful.

    If they follow the diary it will include San Jacinto. It covers the entire campaign in Texas. John Wayne's Alamo is fairly good. I have always liked it, but most people don't realize how far it is from the truth. Since the majority of Americans know little of what happened there and could care less.

    Some of the letters of other people in Santa Annas army do support parts of the diary. For example, others mention the capture and killing of a few defenders at the end. One of them was the officer who tried to get Santa Anna to spare them. A letter was found in his family's records which supported the claim in the diary.

    The key to a good film on this time around will be story and the actors chosen. The majority of older Americans have seen plenty of Alamo movies so I am assuming this will be aimed at the younger generation that has not seen those.

    Last Command, 13 Days of Glory, Man from the Alamo, Davy Crockett at the Alamo are among some already in past on this.

    What might make a better film is to follow Louis "Moses" Rose from his time in Napoleon's army in Europe, to the Mexican REvolution, and ending up at Alamo, leaving the Alamo and the rest of his life(of which little is known-so would be highly fictionalized-he would not want people to know he left there), dying an old man in Nacogdoches. This would span from early 1800s to 1883.

    That would be interesting. Maybe more than another Alamo film.

    J. Also read Gates of Alamo last year. I recommended it to my friend Cary in Ft. Worth.

    take care


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    posted 11-21-2002 05:58 PM PT (US)     

     Marc Flake
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    John,
    In the story I led off with, there was a sidebar directing you to a survey on who would make the best Davy Crockett. As I recall, Matthew MacConnahey (sp?) drew the most votes. Looking at his picture, he does kinda look like Crockett. Unfortunately, he's too young.

    Needs to be an actor closer to 50 or better. Billy Bob just doesn't seem right to me, even though he's got the age closer.

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    posted 11-21-2002 07:17 PM PT (US)     

     John C Winfrey
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    I agree, good actor, too young. Billy Bob no. I would look elsewhere too. There are several good actors that could pull this off. One that could do a good character interpretation of him, they might could use one a few years older, mid 50s etc. Brian Keith in the TV film back in 1985 was horrible. An old man trying to fight in that scene at the end. Horrible. He was much too old for the part. He tried though. James Arness as Bowie was awful too. Way too tall and too old again. Bowie was only 40.

    Hope they don't foul this one up. J.


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    posted 11-24-2002 03:14 PM PT (US)     

     Marc Flake
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    There's a new story on this movie that you can access off The Alamo Movie site (www.alamomovie.com). This one is an LA Times interview with the director.

    Maybe it's just the way he talks, but it sounds like he's making a "politically correct" version of the Alamo, leaning more toward the warts than the heroism.

    I don't know about you, but that bothers me. There's some discussion on the site's message board that leads me to believe that Disney is more interested in how this movie is accepted overseas (like in France and Germany) than in how it is accepted here in Texas and the USA.

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    posted 03-04-2003 06:51 AM PT (US)     

     John C Winfrey
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    Yes, Marc, I have heard a lot more about it lately. Does not sound good. Not based on anything I have talked about or the book a friend of mine mentioned. Its going to be junk sounds like. Sam Houston is a drunk all the time in this, Crockett is portrayed as a coward and other things like this.

    And more like that above too. J. I will pass on it.

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    posted 03-05-2003 06:16 PM PT (US)     

     Lou Goldberg
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    Sam Houston is a fascinating character, not just some drunk. As John Sayles' Lone Star suggested, there is a debate to this day about how the Alamo is seen by Mexicans and Texans. Although it might not always be the most cinematic or entertaining approach to tell a true story on film exactly as it happened, this is a historical event that could benefit from an accurate portrayal, as free from spin as possible. It sounds as if this version of the Alamo is going to be as negative a myth as other versions were positive and as such is just more unneeded obfuscation. Too bad. It's going to wind up disappointing the history buffs, stirring up a lot of talk (good for box office, bad for people who really care), and there's no guarantee anyone is going to care. When Demi Moore did a version of The Scarlet Letter that changed the ending of the book, a lot of people just didn't go based on that fact alone, that it wasn't The Scarlet Letter. The same thing may happen to a film that isn't The Alamo.

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    posted 03-06-2003 02:44 AM PT (US)     

     Marc Flake
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    I'm very disappointed. When I read to my sons about The Alamo, I get stopped several times when they maintain the movie version is different. I take the time to explain that the movie is not real-life and then read them the history.

    I was hoping that a movie would come along that was more accurate. It's a great story and needs no embellishment.

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    posted 03-06-2003 07:19 AM PT (US)     
     

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