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Topic:   Raymond Burr and Godzilla 1985

 John C Winfrey
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My son and I tried to watch this on video back in '85 or '86. I got as far as when Raymond Burr said "Gozilla seems to be searching for something." That is when I got up and turned it off. John.

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posted 03-21-2001 07:14 PM PT (US)    ip  

 H Rocco
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The Japanese version, which is Burrless, is somewhat superior, but still rather compromised. A HUGE amount of money was spent, by Japanese standards, and none of the subsequent sequels have been produced at the same level, budget-wise; still, sometimes one thinks the money was put in the wrong direction (the hopeless 20-foot-tall Godzilla Cybot, for example, any given shot of which jars badly with the suit that was used for most scenes.)

I will forever admire Burr, however, for taking the role on one condition: that the producers not turn GODZILLA 1985 into a total camp-fest. He was justifiably proud of the original, and God knows he didn't need the money when he did GODZILLA 1985, since PERRY MASON and IRONSIDE had made him a millionaire many times over. He did that job for love, not money. Post-production supervisor Anthony Randel was summoned to Burr's Los Angeles home to charm him into doing it, and Burr's first proviso was that the producers remember that the original 1954 film was SERIOUS (whether you believe it or not, Mr. Winfrey, it's deadly serious. Again, the Japanese version is superior to the American, but at least the American GODZILLA, KING OF THE MONSTERS! was assembled with a degree of respect for what had already been done by the Japanese. And realistically, one could hardly have expected regular American audiences, just ten years past World War II, to accept a purely Japanese rendition of the story. Burr's function was to act as a kind of guide and interpreter, and this I think he did reasonably well.)

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posted 03-22-2001 02:12 PM PT (US)    ip  

 John C Winfrey
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I kind of like the original one myself. My Dad and brother and I saw it around 1957 downtown Ft. Worth and a couple of years later on TV. It was the trailer that I was laughing at on that one. The 1985 film was really funny, especially when Burr said that. You really like these films don't you? You may call me John. Don't be so formal. JW.

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posted 03-24-2001 05:19 AM PT (US)    ip  

 H Rocco
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Awright, John, you can call me, well, whatever. (You might remember that I decided that the H stands for Henry, and have also been called Hank. Hank Rocco, syllable-wise, actually scans with my real name, less the middle ones.)

I won't pretend that some of the Godzilla movies aren't complete garbage, especially the hideous GODZILLA VS. SPACE GODZILLA, but it does ruffle my feathers when they're dismissed out of hand. When one considers the vagaries of English dubbing, and the fact that all the sixties and seventies pictures were shot in widescreen -- often quite beautifully, and by industry veterans -- it vexes me to consider that television and most video prints are so cruel to what the filmmakers were actually attempting. I HAVE sensed, especially in the past ten years, a change in this attitude, not least because of the diligent efforts of a handful of self-appointed American ambassadors (myself among them) who actually WENT to Japan and did some hard research. My respect for these guys and what they accomplished only shot up a thousandfold.

There are surprisingly few worthwhile sites to visit -- it's amazing how much misinformation is still being distributed, even by self-proclaimed fans -- but here's an oddball one that inadvertantly gets part of it right (discussing the original GODZILLA) --

http://www.hollywoodjesus.com/godzilla.htm


Follow the "page 2" and "page 3" links for some rather interesting user comments.

Here is a similar one for RODAN:

http://www.hollywoodjesus.com/rodan.htm


This guy really ought to get around to MOTHRA, which has far more overt Christian imagery in it.

Another thought about Raymond Burr: if I'd known how much he actually cared about that old beastie, I would certainly have tried to interview him. One more opportunity lost ...

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posted 03-24-2001 02:02 PM PT (US)    ip  

 Mark Olivarez
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I've had the pleasure of seeing some of the latter Heisei movies in their original non-dubbed form I must say it makes a huge difference to watch it subtitled over the poorly dubbed versions. I had the honor of seeing the original Gojira minus Burr, although it was on German TV when my dad was stationed over there in 1977 I believe. While it was dubbed into German it did not have any edits so I was able to enjoy Ifukube's wonderful opening credits (that piece remains one of my favorites to this day). I recommend to anyone that would like to watch a Godzilla movie or any Kaiju movie to find a subtitled version, letterboxed of course.

Rocco have you read the reviews for the first two DVD's Toho released? Gojira and Rodan, they apparently have an isolated score track and 3 other channels of commentary. I think one may be Ifukube. Of course they are Region 2 and no subtitles. I wish we could get something like that here.

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posted 03-25-2001 08:24 AM PT (US)    ip  

 John C Winfrey
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Hank, thanks for the sites to look at. Both were very interesting. Looking at the list of Godzilla movies and spinoffs, its amazing how many of these I saw over the years, why isn't Gigantis, the Fire Monster on there? I also liked Rodan too. Best, John.

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posted 03-25-2001 10:56 AM PT (US)    ip  

 H Rocco
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GIGANTIS THE FIRE MONSTER!!!! Probably the single worst American version of these movies EVER done. It IS listed at that site, as GODZILLA RAIDS AGAIN (1955), which is its current video title. Same rancid treatment, though. Wall-to-wall narration, endless music (nearly all of it scrubs Masaru Sato's subtler score), RIDICULOUS stock footage, CRAZED dubbing ... I could go on and on about what an atrocity GIGANTIS is, and won't, but will also admit that the American version is a bit of a guilty pleasure, since it's so damn awful.

The Japanese version is significantly better -- GODZILLA RAIDS AGAIN is one possible translation, although previously it was more commonly called GODZILLA'S COUNTERATTACK; another possible translation is GODZILLA STRIKES AGAIN.

Having said that, the Japanese version isn't that good either -- thrown together a few months after the first one was a surprise hit, and it looks it. Beautifully photographed by Seiichi Endo, however (who didn't work on any of the others) -- not so much "black and white" as a symphony of greys. Never considered one of the industry's top cameramen, he nonetheless did a gorgeous job on this. Composer Masaru Sato did an interesting score, even though when I met him, he derided it, and admitted that he was petrified of following in Ifukube's gargantuan footsteps. His later scores for the series (which sometimes subtly reinterpret the GODZILLA'S COUNTERATTACK music) are far bolder, and he mentioned that by then he was confident enough by then to put his own stamp on the series. (Sato and Ifukube were basically the Goldsmith and Williams of their time, although I think musically, Sato more resembles Maurice Jarre, and certainly Ifukube's music sounds nothing at all like John Williams', although he is commonly called "the Japanese John Williams" over there, probably more because of the KIND of pictures he did than the style he used.)

Boxoffice-wise, however, the second GODZILLA film was nearly as big a hit as the first one. Toho Studios wasn't quite sure what to do with this weirdly successful genre however, and sat on the Godzilla character for seven more years, producing some hits (MOTHRA) and many misses (THE MYSTERIANS was a boxoffice disaster, although it's considered a classic in Japan now. I personally can't warm up to it.) The back-to-back successes of MOTHRA and KING KONG VS. GODZILLA -- and the simultaneous flop of GORATH, a good movie, I think -- alerted Toho to the fact that giant monsters were the way to go.

Mark, I'm aware of the DVDs, but don't have any, nor have read reviews. I have a buddy in New York who has one of those rare DVD players (he was wise to buy it in 1994) that can play anything, regardless of region. I think Ifukube has done commentary for them, but doubt it's anything we haven't heard from him before. I am sorely tempted to buy a Japanese DVD player just so I can treat myself to these and upcoming releases from Toho, but I'm nowhere near that financially solvent as yet.

Toho Studios, with which I have dealt from many angles over the years, is a deeply strange, neurotic and litigious company, and the REASON we don't have superior versions of the films in this country is that studio's own intransigence. They've been approached MANY times, for example, by Criterion, which wanted YEARS ago to do a deluxe commentary-laden laserdisc of the first GODZILLA -- and Toho spurned them. Oh, just don't get me started on the subject of Toho ...

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posted 03-25-2001 01:54 PM PT (US)    ip  

 John C Winfrey
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One last comment on Gigantis. You were right on the dubbing, flat stupid. I really laughed at some of it. Especially funny was the scene near the end when the soldier is yelling at the others "Snap it up. Get a move on." and so on. Also when the planes bury him its big icecubes rolling down on him. John.

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posted 03-25-2001 02:48 PM PT (US)    ip  

 H Rocco
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aaah, banana oil!

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posted 03-25-2001 03:21 PM PT (US)    ip  

 H Rocco
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I should add that the first two Godzilla pictures were NOT shot in widescreen, although the current DVD of KING OF THE MONSTERS curiously gives you the letterbox option. Looks the same either way.

Horacio Higuchi (a Brasilian of Japanese descent) produced a superlative bootleg subtitled version of the first one, somewhat better than the one now going around, although the copy of mine has always been disturbingly blurry. (I've gone through several attempts to get this corrected, but it always winds up the same. I don't know what's wrong, since the source version is impeccable.) There's a THIRD subtitled version that, oddly, derives in France, but there's no reason to have it except for completion's sake.

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posted 03-26-2001 02:57 PM PT (US)    ip  

 
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