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The End of an Era

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Author	Topic: The End of an Era

Scott Standard Userer	Ok, it ended pretty much after "The Fox and The Hound," but it is still sad that the last of Disney's "Nine Old Men" passed this past Monday. Rest In Peace Ollie Johnston Scott
posted 04-17-2008 09:45 AM PT (US)

scoreguy16 Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by Scott: Ok, it ended pretty much after "The Fox and The Hound," but it is still sad that the last of Disney's "Nine Old Men" passed this past Monday. Rest In Peace Ollie Johnston Scott Very sad... I didn't even know he had a cameo in The Incredibles! But he was 95, what a full life he lived...
posted 04-17-2008 10:28 AM PT (US)

BackToTheFutureFan Standard Userer	They just don't make animated movies like this anymore and I find it sad. I am so sick of Pixar, children are deprived these days. Very sad.
posted 04-17-2008 01:09 PM PT (US)

Crono/Kyp Standard Userer	I'll agree they don't do animated films like they used to, but Andrew Stanton and Brad Bird and the others at Pixar are all about story and character. Traditional hand-drawn has gone by the wayside these days, the guys at Pixar are still the best guys in the room when it comes to animated storytelling. I'll be the first to tell you that the DTV crap that Disney puts out is crap. Their sequel stuff is horrible, and their last great film was back in 1999 with "Tarzan." (but I am a big fan of "Atlantis" and "Treasure Planet.") But the sad fact is, the great stuff that they did up until "Aladdin" back in the mid 1990s is gone now. Their animated arm is lacking big time, and hopefully one day they will come out of it. Until then, the guys at Pixar (who are not Disney clones or cronies regardless of partnership) are putting out the most original and last great animated stores of the last almost decade. their characters are endearing, their stories are wonderful, they have good messages and if I had kids, I'd have no problem putting them in front of one because they are the best since Disney's hayday, maybe in some respects, better. A master of his craft like Ollie Johnston, who animated some of my childhood favorites, lent his voice to two Brad Bird films. An animation giant who helped out one of the best animation directors today, who, ironically enough, works at Pixar. Then there's Hayao Miyazaki who is on a level all his own. Animation is not dead. It's alive in well at Pixar and Mr. Miyazaki. And Michael, I'm not trying to harp on ya pal, just making a statement. --Brian [Message edited by Crono/Kyp on 04-17-2008]
posted 04-17-2008 02:29 PM PT (US)

BackToTheFutureFan Standard Userer	Oh don't worry, I like opinions! It's just I think the real reason they are making animated films like Finding Nemo and Happy Feet (Computer Generated) is because its cheaper and easier. I think it is pretty bold saying that these new films are better than the older ones. In my pov, there are only a couple good new films like Toy Story, Monster's Inc, and Toy Story 2...but in all honesty I really think they are milking the fact that those films were so successful, that these films are so cheap to make, and the revenue is still the same or even more because these kids have nothing better to watch because nothing better is being made! Oh how I miss the Lion King, Aladdin, Beauty and the Beast, Jungle Book, Fox and the Hound, etc days. Another thing i've noticed them doing is taking one concept (like cars, or robots, or monsters) and take all the cliche's from them and put them in one film. The humor is very redundant. You can really spot their template for these kind of films.
posted 04-17-2008 03:15 PM PT (US)

Camillu Standard Userer	Much as I love the traditionally drawn animated films, I think Pixar, Disney, etc. have maintained an extremely high standard with Toy Story (x2), Nemo, Incredibles, Ratatouille, Happy Feet and a handful of others.
posted 04-17-2008 03:19 PM PT (US)

scoreguy16 Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by Camillu: Much as I love the traditionally drawn animated films, I think Pixar, Disney, etc. have maintained an extremely high standard with Toy Story (x2), Nemo, Incredibles, Ratatouille, Happy Feet and a handful of others. I agree. I'd also like to toss Surf's Up into that. I think it blew Happy Feet away as far as animated penguin movies go.
posted 04-17-2008 04:49 PM PT (US)

Lancelot Standard Userer	I am a Computer Animation graduate, and I can tell you that it is not "cheaper and easier" to do the work that Pixar does. Pixar pushes the limits with every film. Computer animation -- indeed animation in all forms -- is merely a medium, not a genre. I'm not sure that needs underlining here, but it tends to be something that tends to be overlooked by the general populace. Story and character are what drive animated films, and both of those need to work together. The rapidly-churned out direct-to-video often misses that. (I say "often", though not always. Andreas Deja's work on the "Bambi" video is top quality.)
posted 04-17-2008 06:18 PM PT (US)

Scott Standard Userer	What I meant with the death of an era is that besides the hand drawn masterpieces of Beauty and the Beast and others and the Pixar jewels, no animator since the "Nine Old Men", and yes, not even Andreas Deja, have equaled the incredible character animation style and ability of Ollie Johnston, Milt Kahl and the other seven. They are in a league of their own, they are the Mozarts of animation, hands down. While I love the Pixar movies and enjoy CGI very much, and even if traditional animation returns, as far as Character Animation is concerned, I do not see anyone in the horizon who will be able to equal or even top the work of "Disney's Nine Old Men." Scott
posted 04-17-2008 08:57 PM PT (US)

nuts_score Standard Userer	I hate your opinion, Michael; but I think you're a fine fellow. Pixar ain't crap. Huzzah!
posted 04-17-2008 09:35 PM PT (US)

BackToTheFutureFan Standard Userer	Hahahaha, well, I'll stand for my hand drawn animation until the end! Really, no one get's that bland feel from the countless CGI animated films these days?? Oh well! haha [Message edited by BackToTheFutureFan on 04-18-2008]
posted 04-18-2008 12:14 AM PT (US)

Crono/Kyp Standard Userer	I love hand drawn too, but those days are gone. Thank God for Blu Ray mastering huh? --Brian
posted 04-18-2008 01:31 AM PT (US)

BackToTheFutureFan Standard Userer	Haha, yeah. I don't know, CGI is so streamlined. There is something more "organic" about hand drawn to me. For example, do you think they could have made the castle in Beauty and the Beast so amazing using a computer? The animation really creates an atmosphere. CGI films lack the small details IMO. I guarantee the whole mood of that film would have been different.
posted 04-18-2008 10:28 AM PT (US)

scoreguy16 Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by Crono/Kyp: I love hand drawn too, but those days are gone. Thank God for Blu Ray mastering huh? --Brian I am very interested to see what they're doing with Sleeping Beauty. I can only imagine how great that will look. To me, hand drawn films are classic. Each time a new one that is "subpart" is released, it kind of hurts the originals. Does that make sense? I am talking about the straight to video stuff that Disney releases. It kind of makes it look like all the work is for nothing. And CG doesn't ruin that for me, it's just in a different catagory. In other words, there's the classics that Ollie was involved in, and then there's the modern CG films which will probably end up being classics later on down the road... Well, some of them at least (probably not Happy Feet, Surf's Up or Cars...). But I have extremely high hopes for Wall-E!! Who's with me?!
posted 04-18-2008 04:12 PM PT (US)

Scott Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by Crono/Kyp: I love hand drawn too, but those days are gone. Thank God for Blu Ray mastering huh? --Brian Ehm, don't you think your doom prediction is a little pre-mature? Considering that the 48th Animated Feature of Walt Disney Animation is the Frog Princess and is traditional animation and the fact that John Lasseter has made it his mission to revive traditional animation? Scott
posted 04-18-2008 08:07 PM PT (US)

nuts_score Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by scoreguy16: But I have extremely high hopes for Wall-E!! Who's with me?! Me . . . I'll be there first day. This is the most excitement I've felt for an animated film since Beauty and the Beast. I'm more excited for Wall-E than I am for the return of Indy. Call me nutz! Huzzah!
posted 04-18-2008 08:53 PM PT (US)

Crono/Kyp Standard Userer	Scotty, Yes, you are right. I should clarify, that as of late, the traditional style is gone. But you are right, Lasseter is brining it back into Disney's portfolio. Wall-E is gonna be amazing. --Brian
posted 04-19-2008 12:02 AM PT (US)

Bradley Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by BackToTheFutureFan: There is something more "organic" about hand drawn to me. For example, do you think they could have made the castle in Beauty and the Beast so amazing using a computer? I hate to burst your bubble a little bit Michael, but... quote: Computer Animation Beauty and the Beast was a major stepping stone for Disney into the world of innovative computer animation for theatrical animated movies. A relatively unknown company at the time called Pixar produced the rendering software that was used in Beauty and the Beast. Beauty and the Beast mixed traditional animation and select scenes of computer animation together to create new visuals of grandeur for the audience. And the computer animated assisted scene that seemed to capture people's imagination the most was the ballroom scene. "The ballroom sequence features the first computer-generated color background to be both animated and fully dimensional," says Jim Hillin, CGI Artistic Supervisor for Beauty and the Beast. "What this means is that the background is literally moving and the animators had to animate to it in much the same way that they worked with the live action composites in Who Framed Roger Rabbit. This gives the advantage of sweeping camera moves and perspectives as well as theatrical lighting that would otherwise be impossible. It introduces live action techniques into the animated world. Here the camera plays a very important role in establishing the mood and helps us to experience what the characters themselves are feeling." The rest of the article is at www.digitalmediafx.com/Beauty/Features/originalbeauty.html I feel for you Michael, the hand-drawn animated movie is becoming a lost art form. But, I think story has a lot to do with it too. I think the last hand-drawn story that I enjoyed was The Emperor's New Groove (still one of my favorites). And I'll contend, that if any of the Pixar movies had been hand drawn, they would have worked at well. I just don't think you're getting good stories anymore for the hand-drawn movies. And, unforturnately for you, Pixar has created a new animation standard for movies. It doesn't always work e.g. The Wild or Meet the Robinsons or (sorry) Happy Feet, but it does seem to be becoming the standard. However hand-drawn animation is still the art form of choice for the small screen (and probably always will be). Either way, I win because I love them both!
posted 04-19-2008 12:13 AM PT (US)

BackToTheFutureFan Standard Userer	Even that Ball Room scene from Beauty and the Beast looks more detailed than what we see today. Interesting article, thanks for sharing!
posted 04-19-2008 01:41 PM PT (US)

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