-
Message Boards

Movie Soundtracks
Superman Come Back! *NO SPOILERS* (Page 2)
Archive of old forum. No more postings.
Please visit our new forum, The MovieMusic Lobby, to post new topics.
This topic is 2 pages long: 1 2Author
Topic: Superman Come Back! *NO SPOILERS*

Quill
Standard Userer

Shaun -- my comment surrounding an extended cut was centered around "hoping" some of the character inconsistencies would be ironed out. However, as I stated, a 2.5 hour film should not need it, and certainly not a Superman film.Singer needs to control his narrative better. X-Men did more in a shorter run-time.
posted 07-03-2006 05:55 PM PT (US) 
Shaun Rutherford

Standard Userer

I ain't mad atcha, Quill. I'm mad at the world for wasting my time and money.Shaun
NP - Capricorn One (just because)
posted 07-03-2006 08:49 PM PT (US) 
Quill
Standard Userer

Well, I took my wife to see it and the movie held up better with my 2nd viewing. I still say it's too long for what feels like a character driven film...yet has no real character development.
posted 07-05-2006 09:49 PM PT (US) 
Camillu

Standard Userer

We haven't got the film here yet (in Malta - they're too busy releasing Pirates in time with the rest of the world), but I've had the score on constant rotation in my car ever since it was released. I love it. I love the new material, and I obviously love the great renditions of Williams' themes - which together mae it probably the best CD I've heard all year so far.
posted 07-12-2006 05:19 AM PT (US) 
candy_foss
Non-Standard Userer

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE help me!!! Im trying to find what band is singing over the trailer to Superman returns... I think it has been mixed with another song as it sounds kinda familiar. All i know is that part of the lyrics are "I have come so far....." and then some soft rap comes after that. Please Reply!!!!!
posted 07-14-2006 11:54 AM PT (US) 
sean

Standard Userer

quote:
Originally posted by candy_foss:
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE help me!!! Im trying to find what band is singing over the trailer to Superman returns... I think it has been mixed with another song as it sounds kinda familiar. All i know is that part of the lyrics are "I have come so far....." and then some soft rap comes after that. Please Reply!!!!!What's a song?
posted 07-14-2006 01:19 PM PT (US) 
franz_conrad

Standard Userer

Just listened to this a couple of times. The love theme is incorporated very nicely, but other than that I don't think the hybrid really works... and the temp track fingerprints only enhance the patchwork feel. Overall it feels like a City of Prague Philharmonic rendition of John Williams themes, not a John Williams conducted-and-orchestrated piece.
posted 07-16-2006 11:36 PM PT (US) 
Ken S

Standard Userer

quote:
Originally posted by Quill:
I still say it's too long for what feels like a character driven film...yet has no real character development.Exactly.
I've seen SUPERMAN RETURNS now twice, and although I enjoyed it much more on the second viewing, I'm still disappointed by this movie. I think its biggest flaw is in trying to BE too much, while underneath there's just a few words to be said. I also agree whole-heartedly with Shaun Rutherford's view on "the extended DVD version will fix all of the flaws -routine". I expected this movie to be a deeper analysis of Superman himself, but no. The movie concentrated too much on Lex Luthor - so much actually that the more appropriate title should be LUTHOR RETURNS instead of SUPERMAN. Feels somewhat like the old Hammer Dracula movies where Christopher Lee appeared as Dracula for some ten minutes, hissed, showed his fangs and eventually died. Bryan Singer's Superman/Clark Kent does exactly the same thing, bumbles around, flies around saving people, and eventually flies away smiling to the camera - and all this without ANY deeper motive what the superguy himself thought about all it.
Yes, there is the father/boy theme. Yes, there is the troubled love triangle. Yes, there is the "burden" theme - but not a single scene which would establish or even explore Superman's humane side (not to mention his alien side). The tiny speck of the Superdude's humanity (felt strongest when he gets severely beaten up) is totally washed away by the movie's ridiculous Christ references that paint him FIRST as a god and only SECOND a "hero". (Anyone remember Disney's Hercules?)

This religion-stuff is, in my opinion, totally irrelevant to the Superman story (even if these hidden references have been intact from the beginning in the Shuster/Siegel creation). I have always believed Superman to be a good guy because HE believes in good. I think this is where the movie got it totally wrong: explaining that the only reason why the Superdude wants to save us is because he is the savior who has to carry all our sins in his shoulders because his father told him to. Ridiculous. I believe Superman does want to save us because he belives in us and in himself and not in any holy writings interpreted by a dead Hollywood legend.
But then to some lighter subjects:
I was eagerly waiting to see the return of a grand main title sequence, but I, for one, was somewhat disappointed. The original 1978 SUPERMAN prologue & main title sequence is a spellbinding cinematic masterpiece that simply CAN'T be topped with a quiet Star Wars -storybook opening with Marlon Brando's interpretation of God leading to an expolosion of a planet and an empty space after that. And, as someone here already said about the low sound level of the main title music, I think the real problem was in breaking the audience's ears first with the explosion sound effect and only then introduce the orchestral "explosion". (Rather same kind of mistake was made by Joel Schumacher in his PHANTOM OF THE OPERA movie where the chandelier explosion sound effect totally buried the organ "explosion" of the Overture music and thus ruined the musical opening completely). And then the main titles themselves: The font may be the same, but too damn digital-looking to me -- there simply wasn't enough the original sparkle and those beautiful whooshes in these 2006 titles. (Not to mention that John Williams' name goes just too damn quickly after John Ottman's. Could it be purposely done?)
And speaking of the "digitality" of this movie... The thing that really irritated me throughout the movie was the "picture-perfect" digital coating on Superman himself. Even in the scenes where he's probably 100% Brandon Routh he seems like a digitally animated character (smoothly painted with no realistic-looking human skin or movements). The scene which really made me to notice this was the one where Superman descends outside Lois' home and spies the happy family. (---But perhaps I just dislike this digitalized computer-game generation who doesn't respect the true hand-made movie magic of yesterday).
And finally to the music.
The thing that irritated me most on John Ottman's SUPERMAN RETURNS score was what seems to be nowadays the normal procedure in Hollywood movie music: to put a huge choir into every damn sequence of a movie. I have never opposed the use of a big chorus in good movie music, but this "in"-thing with choirs is nowadays simply ridiculous. The movie-going youngsters are already so used to hearing big choirs with their favorite heroes that there's simply no way to use a choir dramatically in movie music anymore. The undersigned yearns for the good old days when a choir was used ONLY to heighten the drama of a specific scene or underline something significant.
The original John Williams 1978 SUPERMAN score is a holy grail to me. I consider it better than any of his STAR WARS scores - and mainly because it contains all the possible human emotions in neat two hour package from chilling horror to childlike wonder, from dead-serious to sincere fun, and is extraordinary rich in its melodic and thematic quantity and quality.
It's good that John Ottman acknowledges all this in his liner notes to SUPERMAN RETURNS soundtrack. I have no doubts that he has poured his very heart into this score - but unfortunately it is not enough. Movie music just isn't today what it was nearly thirty years ago. Today's moviemakers just don't create scenes anymore like, for example, Donner did in 1978 SUPERMAN's "Leaving Home" sequence (which allowed the composers to write authentic melodies and not just background noise), and the composers dare not to "mickey-mouse" in such way as Williams did in his wonderful underscoring for Superman's "first night" in Metropolis. That's why my biggest kicks from Ottman's score are due the small but very magical quotes from Williams' original SUPERMAN score - the "Leaving Home" melody in Ottman's "Memories" works wonderfully and "Can You Read My Mind" surfaces always at the right moment in Ottman's most touching score portions.
However, there is a small "informational" boo-boo in this John Ottman score that I dislike: Both the movie and the soundtrack album acknowledge John Williams only as the composer of the "Superman Theme" ...which gives the impression for the newcomers that all those other magical cues from Williams 1978 score would be composed by Ottman. I have had the heavy duty of correcting many youngsters who have believed the Ottman SUPERMAN score to be genuine John Ottman creation sans the "Superman Theme". Granted, Ottman did a terrific job in adapting all these cues for his score, but it would have been appropriate at least on the soundtrack album to indicate the tracks which include material from Williams' original 1978 score.
Ottman's own "Power of the Sun" is a beautiful composition, but in desperate need to be extended into a full-blown "album version" as Williams did on the Love Theme (Can You Read My Mind) for the end credits. The theme for Lex Luthor, on the other hand, is presented quite well and works effectively in the movie.
One more thing about the movie itself: the "update" troubles.

I still can't make up my mind is the new Superman costume sexy or just plain silly with its lowered waistline (which cries out "very contemporary!"). Anyway, the costume makes the Man look more like the eunuch of the early Superman comics - which can be the purpose of the contemporary politically-correct Hollywood. I just have to say that Christopher Reeve looked more like a man in his tights and stuffings (presumably to hide the "flying" harness).
Of the updating, the younger-looking cast of SUPERMAN RETURNS (Routh, Bosworth, etc) is understandable in today's world where everything over the age of twentyseven is regarded as senile. It is clear that SUPERMAN RETURNS is aimed at younger audiences, while the 1978 original movie was directed for all audiences with its mature but ageless cast. Which one is better aim, is purely a matter of taste.
Is it a bird?
Is it a plane?
No, it's KEN from Finlandposted 08-17-2006 12:48 PM PT (US) Old Infopop Software by UBB
