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Author	Topic: The New World

sean Standard Userer	WOW! What an incredible film! If you enjoyed Terrence Malick's last film, The Thin Red Line, than The New World will certainly do it for you. On the flip side, if you don't like narration, don't like Malick's other outings, than stay clear of his latest; you'll only waste your money and be dissapointed. Not only is The New World gorgeous to look at, and very few recent films can even compare visually, it's skillfully-acted, and the music selected by Malick and (surprisingly) James Horner's score is well-placed and used to great affect. The Thin Red Line, IMO, gave us Hans Zimmer's best score to date, and The New World is certainly one Horner's strongest works in a long while. The streaming clips at the official website of Horner's score seem at odds with what's in the film; that's no big deal, though, since his music sounds a little more conventional on album, but far more interesting on-screen. Those with keen ears will hear the Fransico Lupica "Cosmic Beam" piece from The Thin Red Line also present in the mix. The classical pieces are perhaps the best music in the film and do wonders with the visuals; these pieces are precise and romantic, and at times breathtaking (I know Wagner is in there, and is it Mozart or Bach that's also included for the love theme for Smith and Rebecca[her "new" name]?). The biggest treat has to be the look of the film: much of it was shot on 65mm and the film was cut on film, not employing the often dreadful Digital Intermidiate that so many filmmakers foolishly use today. In a lot of ways The New World surpasses The Thin Red Line, IMO, but the latter will always be special to me. Nonetheless, I think Malick should win some Oscars this time around—he damned well deserves it. Anyway, quit reading this and go see it!
posted 01-20-2006 01:35 PM PT (US)

PeterK FishChip	Cool. I'll see it soon enough. Memoirs of a Geisha is a striking film as far as visuals. Hopefully it's on your list of "very few." As for "cut on film." I certainly hope not, not for the editor's sake. Most film stock is transferred to and cut digitally, with the final cut matched back to film. Maybe I misunderstand your point about cutting film itself, but who would want that expensive, extra-laborious and old fashioned practice? Cutting film in the editing process offers no appeal in any realm. I hope I misunderstand your meaning!
posted 01-20-2006 01:43 PM PT (US)

PeterK FishChip	Ok, I checked up on Digital Intermediate. That's essentially color timing, not editing. Those used to be very different stages of post-production. Technology has made it easier to introduce all kinds of effects digitally. But again, this is about the look of the picture, not how it is chopped up. As you were....
posted 01-20-2006 01:47 PM PT (US)

rkeaveney Standard Userer	Were Wagner and Bach even around when this movie takes place? Ryan
posted 01-20-2006 01:50 PM PT (US)

sean Standard Userer	Peter, Digital Intermidiate, as far as I know, is the process of scanning the film into a digital format to be edited for final print. It looks awful, just check out the transfer on The Transporter 2. They still use negative cutters for this, but the DI imprint is still left there; it gives it a sort of haze or pixelation you'd never get from just cutting the picture with the actual film prints from the negative. I did actually mean it was cut by hand by a negative cutter, using actual film; expensive as this may be, it still looks far better than anything done with digital editing—both War Of The Worlds and Munich were cut in this fashion, as well; Wired magazine had a big article on this at the summer, and it was pretty fascinating. Batman Begins was also finished using negative cutter. In my opinion, those three films look especially more strong visiually than a lot of others released recently. Yes, I agree, Memoirs Of A Geisha does look really striking—though, I believe it was done using DI. The film was enjoyable, too, and a good companion to an excellent novel. Using DI also has the advantage of making sure there's no "clutter" present on the finished print, but that can take away, IMO, the "realness" of it actually being a film. I would argue that cutting on actual film does offer an appeal: it's more hands-on and it's fun as hell—I've done it myself with 16mm and it's a blast; editing on computer just isn't the same, it's not as close or fun as actually handling film and splicing and editing it all together. (That, as I understand it, is also one of the reasons Steven Spielberg refuses to use DI for editing, and perfers to handle the film stock himself; who can blame him?)
posted 01-20-2006 02:03 PM PT (US)

HadrianD Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by rkeaveney: Were Wagner and Bach even around when this movie takes place? Ryan Was the film medium even around when this movie took place?
posted 01-20-2006 02:43 PM PT (US)

PeterK FishChip	Oh hell yes it's fun to chop up film with the equivalent of a sharp little guillotine, yeah. Nothing wrong with a little blood on the floor. But it's slow as hell, laborious, and if you are doing this as a professional you can not pass up the benefit the online editing systems have. Having to catalog and collect physical trims is prehistoric and not conducive to creative freedom. As for negative cutting, that's a different process that requires no "editing" in the creative sense of the word. It is strictly mathematical. Negative cutting is done when all the creative editing is finished, whether that creative editing was done on a Moviola, flatbed or a computer. Michael Kahn uses online digital editing, as he should. You can find articles from more than 10 years ago where he talks about the benefits of these systems (although he's quick to point out that you still need to be an editor... "Lightworks won't edit for you"). I get the feeling you are talking about something else completely with this Digital Intermediate stuff (you did say it was specifically a "transfer" which makes most sense... like color timing is). I don't know enough about it, but it doesn't seem to be a crutch at the creative editing stage. Anyway, I get the point. Malick isn't using a bunch of technology to artificially produce the look of beauty. Good!
posted 01-20-2006 02:43 PM PT (US)

sean Standard Userer	HAHA! Peter, I think we're both going to get hopelessly confused if we keep this up, as I'm on the verge of total confusion right now. But yeah, basically what my point is that Malick didn't use Digital Intermidiate for The New World and it's so much the better for it. Ryan, I know many people don't enjoy your "smart" quips, but remind us all why you posted, exactly? Hadrian makes a perfect point to show your foolishness. It seems to me you had a little tantrum when MUSIC (God forbid!) was used during the pre-recorded and edited boxing matches that took place on The Contender, since as you were so ingenious to point out to all us "surly" dumb readers, that there couldn't possibly be ACTUAL music during a "real" boxing match. And Ryan, when those giant sand worms on Dune come shooting out of the desert what music would ACTUALLY play, if any (since I guess there's no boom-box in the desert to welcome these mighty beasts, if we're going by your strange film music ideas)? Brian Tyler's revision of Trevor Rabin's Deep Blue Sea? Or Toto? Or does ACTUAL music play when giant worms come out of the sand? These are all chalenging and important questions and I hope you'll be able to shed some light on this. "SPICE"!!!!! Oh, and what about when little Irish boys play golf? Does Bryan Tyler's take on Hans Zimmer's Black Hawk Down cue up, at the ready? It is after all the greatest game ever played, is it not? [Message edited by sean on 01-20-2006]
posted 01-20-2006 03:26 PM PT (US)

MWRuger Standard Userer	Think how cool it would have been if the Spice Girls shot out of the mouth of the worm!
posted 01-20-2006 03:35 PM PT (US)

James Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by PeterK: Oh hell yes it's fun to chop up film with the equivalent of a sharp little guillotine, yeah. Nothing wrong with a little blood on the floor. But it's slow as hell, laborious, and if you are doing this as a professional you can not pass up the benefit the online editing systems have. It still happens every once in a while. Gus Van Sant edited his recent death trilogy (Gerry, Elephant, and Last Days) with that sharp little guillotine. Of course, Van Sant could afford to take his time; it's not like those films had crucial release dates with studio-backed marketing blitzes waiting to be unleashed.
posted 01-20-2006 10:02 PM PT (US)

Camillu Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by sean: Ryan, I know many people don't enjoy your "smart" quips, but remind us all why you posted, exactly? Hadrian makes a perfect point to show your foolishness. It seems to me you had a little tantrum when MUSIC (God forbid!) was used during the pre-recorded and edited boxing matches that took place on The Contender, since as you were so ingenious to point out to all us "surly" dumb readers, that there couldn't possibly be ACTUAL music during a "real" boxing match. And Ryan, when those giant sand worms on Dune come shooting out of the desert what music would ACTUALLY play, if any (since I guess there's no boom-box in the desert to welcome these mighty beasts, if we're going by your strange film music ideas)? Brian Tyler's revision of Trevor Rabin's Deep Blue Sea? Or Toto? Or does ACTUAL music play when giant worms come out of the sand? These are all chalenging and important questions and I hope you'll be able to shed some light on this. "SPICE"!!!!! Oh, and what about when little Irish boys play golf? Does Bryan Tyler's take on Hans Zimmer's Black Hawk Down cue up, at the ready? It is after all the greatest game ever played, is it not? lol
posted 01-21-2006 03:46 AM PT (US)

scoreguy16 Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by sean: Oh, and what about when little Irish boys play golf? Does Bryan Tyler's take on Hans Zimmer's Black Hawk Down cue up, at the ready? It is after all the greatest game ever played, is it not? I think there's been some sort of missunderstanding here... The track you speak of is correctly titled "A Beautiful Mind (Pearl Harbor Percussion Remix)" As the theme is directly taken from Horner's score to A Beautiful Mind mixed with the percussion of Pearl Harbor. Clayton
posted 01-21-2006 01:31 PM PT (US)

sean Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by scoreguy16: <BLOCKQUOTE><font size=1 face=arial>quote:</font><HR size=1>Originally posted by sean: [b]Oh, and what about when little Irish boys play golf? Does Bryan Tyler's take on Hans Zimmer's Black Hawk Down cue up, at the ready? It is after all the greatest game ever played, is it not? <HR size=1></BLOCKQUOTE> I think there's been some sort of missunderstanding here... The track you speak of is correctly titled "A Beautiful Mind (Pearl Harbor Percussion Remix)" As the theme is directly taken from Horner's score to A Beautiful Mind mixed with the percussion of Pearl Harbor. Clayton[/B] LOL! Nice! My mistake, of course. That track "A Call To Arms" sounds like HZ's Black Hawk Down, no question about it.
posted 01-21-2006 08:09 PM PT (US)

franz_conrad Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by rkeaveney: Were Wagner and Bach even around when this movie takes place? Ryan And Horner was?
posted 01-23-2006 07:21 PM PT (US)

franz_conrad Standard Userer	As for the whole DI vs neg cut, if FinalCutPro is good enough for Walter Murch, it's good enough for me.
posted 01-23-2006 07:30 PM PT (US)

Dinko Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by franz_conrad: And Horner was? Probably not in person, but the composers he's "inspired by" might have been.
posted 01-23-2006 09:43 PM PT (US)

Scorro Standard Userer	Fantastic movie, even better than expected. Nice score from Horner.
posted 01-23-2006 09:54 PM PT (US)

scoreguy16 Standard Userer	LOL! Nice! My mistake, of course. That track "A Call To Arms" sounds like HZ's Black Hawk Down, no question about it. Actually! I was thinking along the lines of "Dorries First Shot" from Pearl Harbor... which is actually by Steve Jablonsky. But either one works! Clayton [Message edited by scoreguy16 on 01-24-2006]
posted 01-24-2006 12:24 AM PT (US)

MarkA Standard Userer	I really enjoyed this movie, but about half of the audience hated it and either left half way through or made cynical applause at the end. I think if you understand what you are getting yourself into, this movie is outstanding. The classic music selections were excellent, as was Horner's score.
posted 01-24-2006 07:29 AM PT (US)

sean Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by scoreguy16: [b]LOL! Nice! My mistake, of course. That track "A Call To Arms" sounds like HZ's Black Hawk Down, no question about it. Actually! I was thinking along the lines of "Dorries First Shot" from Pearl Harbor... which is actually by Steve Jablonsky. But either one works! Clayton [Message edited by scoreguy16 on 01-24-2006][/B] I forgot about the piece ... but it works either way.
posted 01-24-2006 09:09 AM PT (US)

nuts_score Standard Userer	I'm really glad we are enjoying the film so far amongst are little niche here. I caught a matinee showing on Saturday and was absolutely mesmerized by the film. Absolutely the best film of 2005. That lost shot had most Southern "intellectuals" in the audience either confused or laughing because it was something so simple as two trees standing firm against the wind. But those who payed attention to every detail Malick put forth to the consious viewer understands its significance fully. Horner's score was really good (I have been known to grade Horner but I was really impressed with some of his work this year, this and The Chumscrubber), although I did catch flourishes of an identifiable motif from Braveheart; but all is well. The Wagner piece that ushers in the arrival of the English and the SPOILER death of Rebecca/Pocohantas END SPOILER was so pitch perfect that it lifted the film that extra little bit. But please, be cautious if you've never, ever seen any of Malick's previous cinematic poems or if you have problems with attention disorder; trust me, I was in a theater full of them.
posted 01-24-2006 01:58 PM PT (US)

MarkA Standard Userer	Does anyone know where I can find a listing of the classical music used in the film?
posted 01-25-2006 03:19 PM PT (US)

Demetris Christodoulides Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by MarkA: Does anyone know where I can find a listing of the classical music used in the film? http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0402399/soundtrack [Message edited by Demetris Christodoulides on 01-26-2006]
posted 01-26-2006 04:55 AM PT (US)

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