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Author	Topic: First extended listen to Batman Begins....

zimmerito Standard Userer	Zimmer and howard said what if zimmer start to compose a cue and then howard finished it. but for clips and the 2 complete tracks seems very clear who has composed what. Maybe in cd will be credited the composer of every track...maybe. I'm very happy with the 2 themes."Bruce theme" and his variation to batman "theme",and i'm happy with the black rain-esque.Because i alwas loved it. But the cyclical string section that i loved from the begining of woads to ruin,seems here very repetitive for the clips i heard. Seems everytime batman appears zimmer just used this string section cyclical in bucle. Well...we will know. this week i guess we will have this score. NP:Molossus(track 11)
posted 06-06-2005 02:55 PM PT (US)

sean Standard Userer	Hans Zimmer's used that Black Rain motif quite often in his action scores, but this sounds most like it originally did. I'm impressed by the music and can't wait for the CD. These are not complete tracks, however, as the website labels tracks 10 and 11 as complete. The Batman theme track lasts 01:15, and according to SoundtrackNET this track is actually 04:49 in length. I'm not going to attack you Zimmerito, you simply have different expectations from this score and they obviously haven't been met. My expectations have been exceeded and I am pleased with these clips; my only hope is that there's way more action music than has been promoted so far. NP: Batman Begins (Hans Zimmer and James Newton Howard) ***/***
posted 06-06-2005 03:17 PM PT (US)

zimmerito Standard Userer	you are right sean.I think is the first time zimmer almost copy and paste one of his themes.never before he has done this. I'm happy because i liked(backdraft,prince of egypt,Peacemaker,broken arrow...) and now in full force!!!!!! But one question sean...do you really don't think the cyclical string section and percussion is molossus is too much noise???you are not waiting for more tune??? And i don't understand what you said about the diferent running times..can u explain me???? :P the movie is 140 minuts long.Maybe in some months we will have more music from batman begins :P Np:King arthur ******/*******
posted 06-06-2005 03:39 PM PT (US)

rkeaveney Standard Userer	In this case, 1'15 is enough. Ryan
posted 06-06-2005 05:27 PM PT (US)

HadrianD Standard Userer	IMHO, the cyclical strings + percussion in the Batman score aren't the same as those in King Arthur. They don't sound alike in the least. The only thing the batman strings sounds like is the Black Rain original.
posted 06-06-2005 06:35 PM PT (US)

zimmerito Standard Userer	hadriand...i think the cyclical strings from the begining of woads to ruin are very similar to batman begins strings.maybe a little bit fastest in begins. Of course,the percusion is completly diferent. I think the percusions sounds very much like bats flying...Am i crazy?. And also the sound of this track reminds me the base sound for Injection from Mi2. black rain is obvious!!!! im happy!!!!! really happy! I have mixed feelings about all this.I'm critic with this score,and i was hoping much more complexity but i have the track 10 in repeat since yesterday.i can't stop to listen!!! NP:Bat-Rain.
posted 06-06-2005 06:49 PM PT (US)

HadrianD Standard Userer	Percussion sound ~ Bats flying? I'll go with that. I'll still disagree with you on the King Arthur comparison because with KA, it was more in tune with the whole POTC stuff which I didn't really enjoy that much. The Batman version is quite prominent in resonance to me. It stood out. BTW, the score (in the film) has been getting alot of mix/positive reviews. Cool beans
posted 06-06-2005 07:15 PM PT (US)

zimmerito Standard Userer	Im very very very..and very disagree with u about POTC and KA. POTC is more like gladiator. KA I think have other kind of orchestrations and texture.if you want..other samplers. I think POTC and KA are 2 diferent interpretations of the same style(Zimmer action music). I think the same about POTC than batman begins.(at least track 10,of course begins have much more dramatic parts).Both score i think are bad,but are my guilty pleasures. We will know.... Good reviews about score in the movie?well...but in the 4 forums i visited is not very well reviews the clips and the 2 tracks.is more,many people start to hate this score. Np:Bats flying.
posted 06-06-2005 07:27 PM PT (US)

zimmerito Standard Userer	Sorrry for my english...is late in spain. hadrian and sean.... I think some cue from the japanese preview sounds like dark obsession suite.with the vocals and strings in progression with a dark motive. What do you think? NP:bats flyng
posted 06-06-2005 07:30 PM PT (US)

zimmerito Standard Userer	I was thinking....(too much free time) And i think the first action piece that sounds in japanese preview streaming maybe is the track Myotis(for his lengh ). And i think maybe is the first action track of the score composed by Howard. Howard said that he takes more presence in the first half of the film.I think this because this crap synth is more like the fugitive than other zimmer work. Howard is great with the orchestra,but maybe is no so good with the synth.And I think the first action piece in the japanesse preview is by howard. Any thoughts? NP:First blood 2:Rambo(extended)
posted 06-06-2005 08:15 PM PT (US)

sean Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by rkeaveney: In this case, 1'15 is enough. Ryan Yes, we should all be as disheartened as you that your two favourite "genius" composers Brian Tyler and John Debney didn't decide to join forces and score Batman Begins. (We all know that's your secret wish.) Zimmerito, what I meant by the track times for track 10 is that the German site says it's complete except it's only 01:15 or whatever and the actual total track time for that piece is just under 5 minutes, so what I'm saying is that the clip they released is just a sample and not the actual complete track. And also, I agree with Hadrian that those strings you're talking about do not resemble King Arthur at all. Zimmerito, I'm gonna lay down some criticism here, but I think pretty constructive: You seem to me to be too aware of Hans Zimmer's previous scores when evaluating his newest work. I see what you're saying about Batman Begins and such, but I don't buy it and it's hard for me to hear the resemblences you're describing; it sounds new to me, so I'm not seeing the ends meet in your arguments against the music. You seem to draw all these parallels to his other scores when it isn't necessary. It's Zimmer writing and so we all know it's going to sound like him and there's bound to be similarities, however slight, to many other scores of his; and that's true with all composers, it's their style or their voice coming through. Zimmer or James Newton Howard can't reinvent the wheel here, so no one should expect that.
posted 06-06-2005 09:09 PM PT (US)

zimmerito Standard Userer	i'm not searching parallelisms. I know soo much about zimmer music,that this paralelisms comes alone to my head And of course,zimmer always reinvent himself with new ideas.but his soul is here. What are your favourite goldsmith scores sean??? the 2 last complete tracks in the german site contains the correct lenght.All the clips are 1,15 in lengh.And of course all this are samples. NP:Bats flying.
posted 06-06-2005 09:18 PM PT (US)

zimmerito Standard Userer	Oh..one thing... If you are a zimmer fan you will know that Zimmer when finds something good in one score ,he normaly uses this good idea in his next project. the most evident example is :"ronin" -"Do u think i'm a saxon" And this ciclycal string section is a extension of his job in KA. If you want ...i'm sure in the scores reviews(filmtracks,scoreawe,soundtrack.net) will notice this parallelisms.(aside i think this score will have very bad reviews) in a few days the true of my words will be revealed... :P
posted 06-06-2005 09:25 PM PT (US)

Demetris Christodoulides Standard Userer	BATMAN BEGINS previews (text and audio) from soundtrack.net http://www.soundtrack.net/features/article/?id=150
posted 06-07-2005 05:30 AM PT (US)

zimmerito Standard Userer	I don't have adsl. Normally when i play something with quictime the sound or the video load before be played. But in this link no. And i can't heard anything because the clips are played in real time. what can i do???? In the other links clips are loaded before be played. Well...seems like latly zimmer tendency. I was hoping at least,the final 7 minuts tracks from pure action music and with the main theme played at the end.but seems again 7 minuts of dramatic music.... mmmmm.. NP:7h voyages of simbad(herman)
posted 06-07-2005 07:20 AM PT (US)

zimmerito Standard Userer	"The cue starts off percussively - each percussive hit sounding like a giant bat flapping its wings" now i'm not the only one who things this.definetly are bat flying... im not so insane.
posted 06-07-2005 07:44 AM PT (US)

zimmerito Standard Userer	well....in honor to the black rain sub-theme,One of this zimmer tunes that make me discover the score world,I will try to say where is present this string pulse in other zimmer's score: -Black rain:Chase to the steel plant.(other variation heard in nick decission and final confrontation) -backdraft:farenheit 451(in the base, creating a very dramatic tune) -broken arrow:In everywhere :P -Prince of egypt:Burning bush(at the end of the track,creating a dramatic suport to the Opra Haza main theme) -Peacemaker:In the track peacemaker. -king arthur:Bugget meeting(at the end of the track) some collaborations please...:P
posted 06-07-2005 10:11 AM PT (US)

zimmerito Standard Userer	Black rain:Outburst of rage(the original piece)
posted 06-07-2005 10:23 AM PT (US)

sean Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by zimmerito: What are your favourite goldsmith scores sean??? the 2 last complete tracks in the german site contains the correct lenght.All the clips are 1,15 in lengh.And of course all this are samples. NP:Bats flying. Favourite Goldsmith scores (not in order): Star Trek - The Motion Picture, First Blood, Total Recall, Star Trek V - The Final Frontier, The Edge, Capricorn One, The Great Train Robberry, Patton, Take A Hard Ride, etc. (and that's just naming a few that come to mind). And no, Zimmerito, you're wrong about those track lengths, go check out SoundtrackNET for the correct listing. Those clips at SoundtrackNET are incredible! This is easily going to be one of my favourite scores.
posted 06-07-2005 11:28 AM PT (US)

Marselus Standard Userer	I�m kinda confused right now with what we�ve already heard...the first listen to Molossus was awful, I couldn�t believe what I was hearing. But now I�m starting to enjoy this brainless theme. Although I�m clearly disapointed, I think it can work well in the movie. The main questions are: 1- Was it necessary going to London to record the score? 2- What did Gavin Greenaway conduct? (I can only hear synth strings, loops and other electronic elements). NP Air force One (real action material)
posted 06-07-2005 12:58 PM PT (US)

zimmerito Standard Userer	marselus..i'm with u. but one advice...enjoy the party. Is zimmer at the top of his game. No more. is a historic day.with a historic score. Sean...Some of my favourites goldsmiths are:wind and the lion,total recall,13 warrior,Mulan(promo),first blood2:rambo,firs knight and 2 themes than always make me cry(forever young and Sleeping with the enemy). I was a luckly guy who see goldsmith in a concert. NP:Molossus.
posted 06-07-2005 01:10 PM PT (US)

Marselus Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by zimmerito: marselus..i'm with u. but one advice...enjoy the party. Is zimmer at the top of his game. No more. is a historic day.with a historic score. Sean...Some of my favourites goldsmiths are:wind and the lion,total recall,13 warrior,Mulan(promo),first blood2:rambo,firs knight and 2 themes than always make me cry(forever young and Sleeping with the enemy). I was a luckly guy who see goldsmith in a concert. NP:Molossus. I�ll probably enjoy the party in the movie, but I have a third question: 3- This is what they ended up in 12 weeks?? 84 days for this?? Please.....
posted 06-07-2005 01:21 PM PT (US)

zimmerito Standard Userer	Marselus. I know you. You just have the 2 tracks i send u. How you can judge this score? please...if you was erased you black rain cd. How you can say anything about zimmer??? please... 3 months for compose something fresh and new.With great dramatic parts.track 2 will be amazing.... faith marselus...faith. Leave your rabin and revell scores ,and listen batman begins.if its by this 2 composers don't mind if its bad....its very GOOD!!!!
posted 06-07-2005 01:30 PM PT (US)

Marselus Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by zimmerito: Marselus. I know you. You just have the 2 tracks i send u. How you can judge this score? please...if you was erased you black rain cd. How you can say anything about zimmer??? please... 3 months for compose something fresh and new.With great dramatic parts.track 2 will be amazing.... faith marselus...faith. Leave your rabin and revell scores ,and listen batman begins.if its by this 2 composers don't mind if its bad....its very GOOD!!!! I keep the same opinion.....12 weeks and two of the best composers for this is TOTALLY unacceptable.
posted 06-07-2005 01:35 PM PT (US)

zimmerito Standard Userer	U know what??? Marselus..i'm with u. Is a pure **** . NP:Something by goldsmith
posted 06-07-2005 01:48 PM PT (US)

Jeff78 Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by zimmerito: Marselus. I know you. You just have the 2 tracks i send u. How you can judge this score? please...if you was erased you black rain cd. How you can say anything about zimmer??? please... 3 months for compose something fresh and new.With great dramatic parts.track 2 will be amazing.... faith marselus...faith. Leave your rabin and revell scores ,and listen batman begins.if its by this 2 composers don't mind if its bad....its very GOOD!!!! zimmerito, were you not just yesterday saying how you hated what you have heard and think the score is terrible? Now your telling people how can they judge the score after hearing a few tracks? lol
posted 06-07-2005 02:01 PM PT (US)

zimmerito Standard Userer	Well..marselus is like a brother for me.Is from my country and I know he is losing the faith. I must admit i'm a little bit Dr jekil and Mr hide. Sometimes I listen this score and i liked,and other times I listen this score and I hate it. I'm soo confused...I need help :P NP:wind and the lion
posted 06-07-2005 02:46 PM PT (US)

Dalboz Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by sean: Dalboz, are you one of those "If the score was noticeable in the film, than the composer didn't do his / her job properly?" Actually, no, I'm quite the contrary. If the score is buried and the music doesn't have any effect on the audience, why use any at all? I'm all for it being noticeable! quote: Originally posted by sean: I'm excited about that statement from The Hollywood Reporter. It's a positive sign when a film critic notices the music in the film they're reviewing, IMO, since they seldom bring it up. Not when the review CRITICIZES the music, which was my point in the first place. The review states: "The music credit is shared by two top film composers, Hans Zimmer and James Newton Howard, so it's hard to know whom to blame for its own schizophrenia wherein the major themes are rousing and memorable but the score comes on too strong in many sequences." Rousing and memorable is very good, I agree. But saying it's too loud, imho, is not good if it dragged the review AWAY from the movie to the point that he felt the need to comment on it negatively (which is the only negative comment in the entire review, I might add). Just my 2 cents. :P
posted 06-07-2005 04:21 PM PT (US)

zimmerito Standard Userer	http://www.latinoreview.com/films_2005/wb/batman/review.html The score composed by James Newton Howard and Hans Zimmer has no real theme like Danny Elfman�s operatic cues from the original film, but that�s okay. This is the beginning of Batman�s legacy and within this story he hasn�t become completely defined yet. I do wish that Howard had scored the film alone since Zimmer tends to write his music with a bit of that big brass "Bruckheimer When critics will stop to think that zimmer is only brass and action music.Zimmer composed 103 films and maybe just 10 have this "bruckheimer sound"(well...zimmer made the bruckheimer sound actually)Maybe this critics have to listen the full zimmer discografy before to talk.
posted 06-07-2005 08:13 PM PT (US)

HadrianD Standard Userer	I guess no one knew that the "Bruckheimer" sound IS the Zimmer sound.
posted 06-07-2005 09:47 PM PT (US)

Marselus Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by HadrianD: I guess no one knew that the "Bruckheimer" sound IS the Zimmer sound. We all know that ANYTHING coming from Bruckie is gonna be severely criticised, and the score is no exception. But I�m sure that the more his work is criticised, the more Jerry laughs....and the same for Zimmer, I have no doubt about it.
posted 06-08-2005 11:05 AM PT (US)

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