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Author	Topic: National Treasure score

PeterK FishChip	So, there are 150+ members of the AFM listed in the liner notes for Trevor Rabin's score CD. Listening to the CD, we should be wondering where the heck all these members are, as it sounds to me like there may have been 10 players needed to create the acoustic samplings used in the music. Maybe the accounting department forgot to write down the musicians' names and "for the sake of legally covering their butts," they just listed every player on the AFM roster for each instrument used? Heh. No conductor credit either (makes sense, although weird). It's an odd thing, any way you check it. Any comments on this score? Same ol' same ol' from Bruckheimer and company... [Message edited by PeterK on 11-19-2004]
posted 11-19-2004 01:30 PM PT (US)

Mark Olivarez Standard Userer	Another score to avoid then Peter? Sometimes I think it only takes one person to churn out scores for Bruckheimer's films.
posted 11-19-2004 04:23 PM PT (US)

Bond1965 Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by Mark Olivarez: Another score to avoid then Peter? Sometimes I think it only takes one person to churn out scores for Bruckheimer's films. That's funny. One person! HA!!! Weren't there like a dozen on "Pirates of the Carribean?" And when was the last time a MV composer (excuse me...FORMER MV composer) worked alone? James
posted 11-19-2004 05:22 PM PT (US)

Lancelot Standard Userer	When was the last time any composer worked completely alone?
posted 11-19-2004 06:00 PM PT (US)

PeterK FishChip	There are actually only three credited composers on National Treasure. Bondo: I don't know about that one. Lancelot: This year. MarkO: Yes, this is one to avoid.... not because it sucks, but with something like Mutiny on the Bounty now being available... and, with new Varese Club discs coming on Monday (come on, Spartacus!), there are plenty of reasons for avoiding National Treasure in the near future.
posted 11-19-2004 06:25 PM PT (US)

Mark Olivarez Standard Userer	I don't know if I could survive the thought of a 2-3 disc Spartacus being released within weeks of FSM's 3 disc Mutiny On The Bounty. I don't think my heart could take the excitement.
posted 11-19-2004 07:31 PM PT (US)

Dinko Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by PeterK: and, with new Varese Club discs coming on Monday The what? Oh right! You mean the over hyped, over priced releases that Var�se Sarabande Records, Inc. keeps releasing periodically for no reason but to show they can still produce limited 20$ frisbees.
posted 11-19-2004 08:08 PM PT (US)

jonathan_little Standard Userer	I think Varese Club is going to have a hard time beating stuff like Rozsa's The Jungle Book or Kaper's Mutiny on the Bounty. I hope they release three or four Horner scores because my wish list is way too long already. NP: Diamonds Are Forever [Message edited by jonathan_little on 11-19-2004]
posted 11-19-2004 10:26 PM PT (US)

Lancelot Standard Userer	Let's hear it then, just for posterity's sake, then, Peter-- Composed/Arranged/Conducted by...?
posted 11-21-2004 02:42 PM PT (US)

PeterK FishChip	Okie dokie. There are many scores composed by a single composer all the time. If your statement is shrouded in qualification I didn't pick up on, I would appreciate some clarification. But, with no qualifications in mind, I checked out this weekend's box office winners... sure enough, score for #2 biggest film of the weekend was written, conducted and orchestrated solo. I stopped there. "The 96 piece London Metropolitan Orchestra was conducted and the entire score was orchestrated and produced by Gregor Narholz." SpongeBob Squarepants
posted 11-21-2004 04:45 PM PT (US)

Bond1965 Standard Userer	While not a box office smash, "Birth" was composed, orchestrated and conducted by Alexandre Desplat. A majority of European composers do it all. Or at least do their own orchestrations. I recall Rachel Portman stating she preferred to do the orchestrations herself as otherwise it didn't feel like she was doing the work. I know John Scott does all his own orchestrations and Morricone does too. I realize with post production on movies getting shorter & shorter, most composers do rely on orchestrators to help finish the job. I think it just gets to be ridiculous when you have 12 guys writing one score. (i.e. "The Color Purple" or "Pirates of the Caribbean") and it ends up sounding like they copied someone's else's score. James
posted 11-21-2004 05:13 PM PT (US)

Mark Olivarez Standard Userer	While it's obvious that most Bruckheimer scores are done by groups at a time I guess I should have worded it a little different. Most Bruckheimer scores sound like they were done by one person because the quality of music sounds like someone working out of their garage on a key board.
posted 11-22-2004 06:38 AM PT (US)

HadrianD Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by Mark Olivarez: the quality of music sounds like someone working out of their garage on a key board. Wow...
posted 11-22-2004 09:04 AM PT (US)

Philipp Standard Userer	I think James Horner is orchestrating his scores on his own,too. Philipp np: hpatpoa (john williams)
posted 11-22-2004 09:25 AM PT (US)

scoreguy16 Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by Bond1965: I think it just gets to be ridiculous when you have 12 guys writing one score. (i.e. "The Color Purple" or "Pirates of the Caribbean") and it ends up sounding like they copied someone's else's score. James Considering the ammount of time they had to write Pirates, I'd say the 9 composers did a pretty decent job. Deffinately not award worthy or anything, but still a fun score. Clayton
posted 11-22-2004 12:14 PM PT (US)

BMikeJ Standard Userer	9 composers, 12 composers... What's the difference? James made a valid point. The score is fun but totally derivative.
posted 11-22-2004 12:27 PM PT (US)

Dinko Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by Bond1965: I think it just gets to be ridiculous when you have 12 guys writing one score. (i.e. "The Color Purple" or "Pirates of the Caribbean") and it ends up sounding like they copied someone's else's score. quote: Originally posted by scoreguy16: Considering the ammount of time they had to write Pirates, I'd say the 9 composers did a pretty decent job. Deffinately not award worthy or anything, but still a fun score. Don't you just hate it when you have to agree with two people on opposite sides of an issue? I mean... it is ridiculous that 9 people produced a score that sounds like someone else's work, regardless of how much time they had to score it. And yet, the score is one of those I enjoyed most in the past two or so years, and it doesn't really remind me of anyone else in particular, other than a broadly defined "Media Ventures" type of sound.
posted 11-22-2004 12:45 PM PT (US)

BigT1981 Standard Userer	Dumb question here but what's considered a "Media Adventure"? Trent
posted 11-23-2004 06:57 AM PT (US)

Al Standard Userer	National Treasure is, without a doubt, the best film of the decade. It offers excitement--Nicholas Cage swinging from a rope across a bottomless pit; it offers education--Nicholas Cage shows us how to swipe the Declaration of Independence (with two people no less); it offers drama--Jon Voight, Cage's father, doesn't approve of his son's quest for the treasure, but ultimately comes to accept him; and it offers a dynamic score--Trevor Rabin's noble score is both deeply moving when it should be and inventively exciting when the guns start shooting (all without a memorable theme!) Just when I thought there was no way to top King Arthur, Bruckheimer--as both circus ringleader and schoolteacher--does it again! Yes, I think it's easy to say that I see Oscars for everyone involved.
posted 11-23-2004 10:05 AM PT (US)

scoreguy16 Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by Al: National Treasure is, without a doubt, the best film of the decade. It offers excitement--Nicholas Cage swinging from a rope across a bottomless pit; it offers education--Nicholas Cage shows us how to swipe the Declaration of Independence (with two people no less); it offers drama--Jon Voight, Cage's father, doesn't approve of his son's quest for the treasure, but ultimately comes to accept him; and it offers a dynamic score--Trevor Rabin's noble score is both deeply moving when it should be and inventively exciting when the guns start shooting (all without a memorable theme!) Just when I thought there was no way to top King Arthur, Bruckheimer--as both circus ringleader and schoolteacher--does it again! Yes, I think it's easy to say that I see Oscars for everyone involved. I'm pretty sure King Arthur was just made to be a fun entertaining adventure flick. I don't think you should it expect anything more out of it. That's my main problem with critics, they always think thing should be Shakespear even if it's meant just to be a fun popcorn flick. Oh well, I guess people just don't get it. Of course, I still haven't seen National Treasure so for all I know it could just be a steaming pile of monkey do do. But I will always defend popcorn flicks!!! Clayton
posted 11-23-2004 10:57 AM PT (US)

Dinko Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by scoreguy16: But I will always defend popcorn flicks!!! Oh yeah? Always? Wait till popcorn costs 15$ a barrel and you have five kids who each want a different flavour. We'll see how much you'll be defending popcorn flicks then!
posted 11-23-2004 11:21 AM PT (US)

scoreguy16 Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by Dinko: <BLOCKQUOTE><font size=1 face=arial>quote:</font><HR size=1>Originally posted by scoreguy16: [b]But I will always defend popcorn flicks!!! <HR size=1></BLOCKQUOTE> Oh yeah? Always? Wait till popcorn costs 15$ a barrel and you have five kids who each want a different flavour. We'll see how much you'll be defending popcorn flicks then! [/B] Well I hardly actually go to the movies. It's too expensive already at $8.50. I just wait for video and then I can pause, rewind, or watch it again if I want, without the annoying kid beind me throwing goobers at me and shining his laser pen on the screen and jumping at things that aren't scary... I hate movie theaters... Sorry, got lost on my rant there. Clayton
posted 11-23-2004 01:34 PM PT (US)

Al Standard Userer	"I don't think you should it expect anything more out of it. That's my main problem with critics, they always think thing should be Shakespear even if it's meant just to be a fun popcorn flick. Oh well, I guess people just don't get it." It's not that people "don't get it." Some people just have a different idea of fun and entertaining. Despite my snickering to the person next to me, the popcorn I was eating was the only good thing about this flick. It's the Kangaroo Jack of Bruckheimer action movies.
posted 11-23-2004 02:08 PM PT (US)

HadrianD Standard Userer	I see my movies in the daytime.... I'll see if this movie is as good as everyone says it is
posted 11-23-2004 08:59 PM PT (US)

scoreguy16 Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by Al: It's the Kangaroo Jack of Bruckheimer action movies. Wasn't Kangaroo Jack a Bruckheimer "action" movie? Of course, i don't think anyone wants their name on that movie. Clayton
posted 11-23-2004 09:22 PM PT (US)

Al Standard Userer	But National Treasure isn't marketed for five-year olds, although it's hard to tell from the writing.
posted 11-24-2004 10:06 AM PT (US)

Lancelot Standard Userer	Despite the pre-existing disdain some members have for Bruckheimer films on the whole, National Treasure does come off as something of a family film--the film does have the "Walt Disney" label on it, to add to which, there's no brutal violence, only one big explosion, and a bit of historical sightseeing all in the name of good fun.
posted 11-24-2004 09:08 PM PT (US)

Al Standard Userer	I don't have pre-existing destain for Bruckheimer films on the whole; I do presently have disdain for National Treasure though. Just because it's a family film made in the good name of fun doesn't give it any excuse to be so poorly written.
posted 11-24-2004 09:29 PM PT (US)

Lancelot Standard Userer	What's your basis for comparison?
posted 11-25-2004 04:47 AM PT (US)

Al Standard Userer	I suppose I'll just keep the comparison to another Bruckheimer, since it's somewhat unfair to compare it to the also PG-rated Indiana Jones, which National Treasure sometimes wishes it was (aside from a Da Vinci Code knock off). "Pirates of the Caribbean" may have been PG-13, for action violence, but I still think that's a much better Bruckheimer that appeals to the whole family, is more fun, and has much more clever writing, along with better directing. Also, comparing it to another PG Jon Turtletaub flick, Cool Runnings is a little more historical, being based on a true story, and is more involving as a result. Again, my complaint is not so much with Bruckheimer or even Turtletaub, since it's his first time doing an action film--aside from the masterpiece that was "3 Ninjas," but rather with the screenwriters Cormac and Marianne Wibberley, who are fresh off of Bad Boys II and just create a watered-down Bruckheimer action flick to appeal to the whole family. Brad Bird could appeal to the whole family with his Incredibles cartoon, and I think that's more of an accomplishment.
posted 11-25-2004 11:00 AM PT (US)

John C Winfrey Standard Userer	Well, we saw this tonight after our family get-together. It was so-so. IN places it was ok but lots of cheesy lines so typical of Bruckheimer films. And the score was very similar to many others by Zimmer, Badelt etc as mentioned above. It definitely was not the best film of the decade by any means. LOL. Here are the grades the five people who saw it gave it\|: dau 1-D dau 2-C friend-C another friend-C son-in-law-c-/D+ me B------------------ I was the easiest on it. J.
posted 11-25-2004 05:11 PM PT (US)

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