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      Williams Re-scoring & Episode III

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    Topic:   Williams Re-scoring & Episode III

     SkyMakers
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     Oscar® Nominee
     

    I don't know how and why the rumors got started about Williams re-scoring the first trilogy and he being pissed off about the hack job of his score for AOTC and hence weren't sure about scoring for Episode III.

    Friends, don't be so easily fooled by stupid rumors. It makes it appear as if that some of you read the National Enquirer and got tricked into owning some very false information, along with very many people who listens to gossip like that.

    Firstly, I wonder how many of you realize the tremendous costs of scoring for films. So, please think about that for a moment when reading rumors about Williams re-scoring the trilogy or the Indiana Jones series. For what end would Williams, Lucas or Spielberg would even consider such?

    I guess there are some that would believe that Beethoven should rescore his 5th Symphony.

    Furthermore, the rumors about him being pissed off due to the hack job of AOTC, well, for one thing, even if it did happen, obviously it didn't piss Williams off so much that he refused to score Episode II. Plus, he already said that he was looking forward to scoring Episode III.

    Remember, Williams is not as insecure as many of us would like to believe. I think there are plenty of people that makes assumptions based on our own sensibilities.

    So, unless you're very gullible, don't be so easily misled. The net are so full of misleading information. Be glad that you're not one who was gullible enough to be fooled by investments with 120% return, per day.

    One thing that we ought to remember, are the kind of character Williams is, and once we know that, we can stand on our own feet as to his attitudes when it comes to his work. Which means, if we receive information about him that's outside of his character, you can pretty comfortably regard it to be a lot of bull.

    At the same time, I've been finding people at FSM, MovieMusic and JWFan boards, that critize Williams as if he should be an 800 pound gorilla and throw his weight around, just to please us.

    The first person he'll please is his creative self. It's by that standard that all of us have come to enjoy his music, and it's by that he will continue to pursue his creative venture. So, for those who find it lacking and unsatisfying, well, I would like to assume that he'll please the first person foremost, who are responsible, that is, the director. So, if you don't like it, then blame the director. Because, I can tell you now, that Williams is a lot more superior than some of you have downgraded him to be.

    Also, don't listen to his music like it's a symphony, but listen to it in context. His main purpose is not to make a CD player friendly score, but to accompany his visuals. If you're not happy with the music, then blame the visuals or underpinning tone of the scene, don't blame Williams for it. His intelligence and musical knowledge is a great deal more deeper than any of us will ever know.

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    posted 05-15-2002 12:51 PM PT (US)     

     André Lux
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    Perfect sir!

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    posted 05-15-2002 01:06 PM PT (US)     

     Bozman
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    I like John Williams a lot, but you have to understand that however big he is, he is not George Lucas. Of course he's going to say in press interviews that he's looking forward to Episode III. Does George Lucas have the money to rescore part or all of Episode IV? You bet!

    The film industry is like a game with very political rules. Williams has a 3-picture contract with Lucasfilm and that contract gives Lucas the right to do whatever the hell he wants to with Williams' score whether he likes it or not.

    There are plenty of dirty tricks in the industry, and a great many things that are never made public....(like that fact that Episode II was in fact not shot all on 24-P). I guess what I'm trying to say is that while it's true you can't always believe what you read on the Internet, you should ALSO not always believe what you read in the L.A. Times, N.Y. Times, see on TV news, etc.

    NP: Fela Kuti

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    posted 05-15-2002 01:50 PM PT (US)     

     dgoldwas
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    quote:
    Originally posted by Bozman:
    like that fact that Episode II was in fact not shot all on 24-P

    Details?
    Dan

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    posted 05-15-2002 02:18 PM PT (US)     

     Ricard L. Befan
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    Skymaker,

    Since you have posted the same message here and on the jwfan.net message board, I'll re-post my reply too:

    The rumor about Williams rescoring SW:ANH (NOT the first trilogy, JUST ANH) comes from an interview supposedly published in a Dutch magazine. You should know this. It's on the Latest News forum of JWFan.net.

    Regarding the other "rumors": As far as I know, NOBODY has ever said that Williams was pissed off about the hack job of his score for AOTC and hence wasn't sure about doing Ep. III.

    Such rumors DO NOT EXIST. They are just speculation. Opinions. NOT rumors.

    But perhaps you're referring to TPM (not AOTC). In that case I have to tell you that this is 100% true, NOT a "rumor".

    The source for this is an interview from French magazine Starfix in Fall' 99:

    Q: "Certain sequences of The Phantom Menace, especially the final battles, do not suit your partition well."
    A: "There were circumstances I could not control. I scored the first edit of the film. George Lucas then showed the film to several people, among them Steven Spielberg and Ron Howard...and a second edit was made. I made the necessary and adequate changes, but most of the time, this ended up suppressing complete measures. The [coherence] was affected, but during the February sessions, we made sure everything was as linear as possible. At that time, I had no problems with George Lucas, not even a musical dissatisfaction because, musically, it was impossible for me to write, re-record, and fit any new music. So I recalibrated my compositions for the new edit. After these sessions, George again showed the film to his friends and obviously, this ruined that second [coherence]. George Lucas preferred to mix in certain passages of my music that he took from elsewhere, rather than asking for me to write new music, which I could not have done anyways. We can't fall into acute fatalism, even though as a musician I would have liked things to have gone differently. George Lucas knows that very well because my reaction as an artist was to initially give him a sense of disapprobation that, I think, he understood. He made a choice which was probably necessary but which artistically annoys me on a couple of minutes. I am not the type to do polemics, because this experience was extraordinary. It is nevertheless very unfortunate that the decisions made between Febuary, March, and April of 1999 were not made six months earlier. Now that The Phantom Menace is out in the U.S., I can permit myself this slight reticence."


    -- Ricard, *trying* to clear some things up.

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    posted 05-15-2002 02:46 PM PT (US)     

     jonathan_little
     Oscar® Winner
     

    In other slightly-related news...

    CNN aired a piece on Episode II's music earlier today. It had plenty of great shots of the London Symphony Orchestra with Johnny. After that, there was a live interview with Williams.

    Happy Happy. Joy Joy. This was at about 11:45am EST.

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    posted 05-15-2002 06:45 PM PT (US)     

     Scott
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    Ricard,

    I read that interview as well. It truly shows Williams as I know him, diplomatic, humble and gracious; not really pissed off.


    Scott

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    posted 05-16-2002 08:17 AM PT (US)     

     Ricard L. Befan
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    Of course. it's an interview. He HAS to be polite. But I think the message is clear.

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    posted 05-16-2002 09:25 PM PT (US)     

     justin boggan
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    SkyMakers
    "Firstly, I wonder how many of you realize the tremendous costs of scoring for films. "

    But do you realize how much money this film is going to gross? They could afford to have this film scored by several other composers and still have money left over. A hack job is a show non-chalant thinking. They don't seem to care enough to do a good job.

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    posted 05-16-2002 09:39 PM PT (US)     

     Bozman
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    Dan,
    I can't elaborate too much for a variety of reasons. Basically there were a lot of problems with the 24-P camera.....and I'll have to leave it at that for the public board.

    Cheers!

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    posted 05-17-2002 12:44 AM PT (US)     

     Scott
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    Ricard,

    serioiusly though. Does Williams' personality really fit the description "pissed off"? Sure, he probably was angry, but I don't think he went up to Lucas using Yoda moves to get his point across.


    Scott

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    posted 05-17-2002 07:26 AM PT (US)     

     tranked
     Oscar® Nominee
     

    I like the idea of the imperial march being used in ANH for continuity reasons, that's all i read into this re-scoring.



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    posted 05-17-2002 06:47 PM PT (US)     

     Ricard L. Befan
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    quote:
    Does Williams' personality really fit the description "pissed off"? Sure, he probably was angry, but I don't think he went up to Lucas using Yoda moves to get his point across.

    Scott,

    I din't use that expression. Skymaker did.

    But you seem to agree that Williams was angry. Good. That was my whole point.

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    posted 05-17-2002 11:53 PM PT (US)     

     UCFKevin
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    Williams SHOULD be angry. I certainly was. I find it incredibly insulting to just throw away new music and use old music in it's place.

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    posted 05-18-2002 07:04 PM PT (US)     
     

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