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FSM: Joy in the Morning
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Topic: FSM: Joy in the Morning

Lou Goldberg

Romulan

My guess was correct! FSM forever!Ever since a short 7 minute suite from Joy in the Morning showed up on Rhino's The Lion's Roar CD I had a feeling this score would show up in its entirety. Now that FSM has made an assault on MGM scores along side 20th ones, this was one of the possibilities.
I've always liked this strange film even with Richard Chamberlain being harsh and homophobic. It starts with a neat stunt--a kid climbing a staircase in roller skates--and settles into its story about the pressures a young married couple face living with each other at a college in the 20s. One idea I've always liked is the bit where Yvette Mimieux waits outside the classroom on the stairs while her husband is in class inside. And, one very sweet moment comes when the gay florist calls Yvette Mimieux some word she's never heard before and she looks it up later in a dictionary and realizes it was a very nice compliment.
Herrmann's score is very lush and romantic and sounds like Vertigo as Blue Denim does. In fact, it sounded so typical Herrmann/Vertigo that Hitchcock, already souring on Herrmann, was displeased with it, hoping that Herrmann's score to Torn Curtain wouldn't sound like that too (it didn't, but that still didn't help things).
FSM also is putting out The Man Who Loved Cat Dancing as someone on the board hoped they would. I know the Williams fans are glad to have another one, but I don't really care for this score much. Unless you like that folksy, country sound, I'd stay away from this.
Now if FSM wants to tell us what their Tiomkin is going to be..............I'm all ears.
[Message edited by Lou Goldberg on 04-02-2002]
posted 04-02-2002 10:22 PM PT (US) 
Lou Goldberg

Romulan

Well, I went on line and bought it. Hopefully it'll be here next week and I'll have more to say then.
posted 04-03-2002 09:29 PM PT (US) 
Luscious Lazlo

Romulan

Thru sheer serendipity, I discovered that Richard Chamberlain recently essayed the role of Captain von Trapp in a production of THE SOUND OF MUSIC. (By the way, did you know that in the movie version of THE SOUND OF MUSIC, Christopher Plummer's singing was dubbed? I just thought I'd let you know that *I* know.)I dislike a lot of Bernard Herrmann because of his incessant heavyosity. His fever-pitch lush-shtick leaves me absolutely cold.
posted 04-04-2002 03:58 PM PT (US) 
JJH

Romulan

Can't wait for this CD.love that Hermann.
posted 04-04-2002 11:30 PM PT (US) 
Lou Goldberg

Romulan

CD came in the mail today. You can't even say good, weak, great, or masterpiece, it's Herrmann, and Herrmann I've wanted to years, so I'm too biased to rate it 'objectively'.The score sounds a great deal like Marnie and has sections that would appear in the Clarinet Quintet. Then it's peppered with mini-scherzos like the one that comes when Gregory Peck greets his family in the first act of Cape Fear. Hell, what else do you need?
According to the liner notes, it's the school dean and not the florist who tells the wife she's an asset, one's memory for details gets blurry at my age.
posted 04-06-2002 08:16 PM PT (US) 
Lou Goldberg

Romulan

Been spending more time with this. Although I like the theme that Herrmann didn't write, I don't like the vocal. The theme itself reminds me of a children's tune, an odd association (or perhaps the right one) for this tale about marriage. The rest of the score, as good as the writing is, isn't as cohesive as its obvious predecessor Marnie. Although Joy involves repeating motifs, the imposed theme replaces one that Herrmann might have come up with, and what's left is color, Herrmann decorating scenes one cue or phrase at a time. Good color, great color, but something with less impact than the scores it comes between, Marnie and Torn Curtain (Rejected). Just the same, calling a score lesser Herrmann is like saying that Ruth and Esther or Romans are lesser because they aren't the Gospels or the Pentateuch, "lesser" Herrmann still towers above most of what's out there.
posted 04-09-2002 09:00 PM PT (US) 
jonathan_little
Romulan

I picked this up from FSM recently...I have to agree with Lou that the vocal is crappy. "These are the things I will give to my darling. These are the things to my darling I'll give." -- What the hell is that!?
Anyhow, onto the good stuff.
I never thought I'd find myself enjoying scores that are so much strings and so little brass, but Herrmann is able to keep my interest. I'm a pretty new Herrmann fan, as I've been only enjoying his work for a little over a year.
For this one, I guess Herrmann had a theme shoved down his throat, and in response, he decided to shove it down ours. I think it's an enjoyable theme, but it sure is used quite a bit. The sequencing of the album may be to blame for making some of this repetition worse at the beginning of the album (film order, I assume), but I'm too lazy right now to rearrange the tracks into a better listening experience.
The sound quality of the album is alright. The violins sound a bit "weird," but I can't quite describe why I feel that way.
All in all, I thought this was a pretty enjoyable score. I should spend some time trying to find a better track sequence, probably one that would leave out that cheesy main title song.
posted 03-09-2003 06:36 PM PT (US) 
Luscious Lazlo

Romulan

http://www.musicweb.uk.net/film/2002/Jun02/Joy_in_the_Morning.htmlMARK HOCKLEY SAID: "Herrmann does 60s romance! But of course with this composer there is always a shadowy undercurrent, one that darkly shimmers through every note of this intriguing score. Prominently featuring a trendy (for the time!) title song written by Sammy Fain and Paul Francis Webster (with a vocal rendition by Richard Chamberlain on the MAIN TITLE), unfortunately it's not really very good. Herrmann's original music on the other hand is lyrical and lush, despite being borderline melodramatic at times, but thankfully he manages to counterbalance this with his usual penchant for dark subtlety. The composer also makes interesting use of the rather bland title song, giving it various imaginative interpretations and references throughout the score (THE WAITING ROOM/PORTICO, THE SHOWER, THE NEW LOOK etc.), but a lack of diversity is the soundtrack's biggest demerit and there are few outstanding moments. Even so, anything by the truly great Mr. Herrmann is a must have, although this is in many ways a minor work in terms of his formidable career. Despite this, it is still worthy of attention and displays yet again his singular emotionally charged outlook, one that coupled with a certain darkness of the soul has created some of the most enduring film music ever written."
[Message edited by Luscious Lazlo on 03-09-2003]
posted 03-09-2003 06:56 PM PT (US) 
Luscious Lazlo

Romulan

http://www.musicfromthemovies.com/pages/reviews/joy_in_morning.htmlPETER LANE SAID: Herrmann, as so often in the later years found himself hemmed in by a title song, this time from the ubiquitous Sammy Fain, which he was obliged to use extensively...There is also a haunting love theme of the composer's own invention.
Nevertheless, throughout the score there is an inescapable sense of Herrmann revisiting in a fairly uninventive way the emotional and aural world he had fashioned in VERTIGO and subsequently explored in TENDER IS THE NIGHT and MARNIE.
None of this was lost on Alfred Hitchcock. Having just seen JOY IN THE MORNING, the director remarked to his assistant that Herrmann was using music that rightly belonged to his films. Thus, the stage was set for the disastrous argument the following year between the two men over the score for Hitch's next film, TORN CURTAIN.
[Message edited by Luscious Lazlo on 03-09-2003]
posted 03-09-2003 07:13 PM PT (US) 
Lou Goldberg

Romulan

Gee, these guys aren't saying anything too off from what we said. Maybe I should ask Peter for a check for these postings
The anecdote about Hitchcock hearing the Joy score and not liking it was in Smith's bio of Herrmann. It almost seems as if Hitchcock was souring on the Herrmann sound so that no matter what Herrmann wrote for Torn Curtain it was likely Hitch was going to be unhappy and reject it. In the documentary on Herrmann, David Raksin calls Hitch names for being disloyal to Herrmann. But perhaps Hitchcock was actually being loyal to Herrmann, giving him the job and taking the chance in letting him try to do something new when he was really thinking about another sound altogether. The problems with that were two-fold: 1) You hire Herrmann you get Herrmann not Herrmann doing some pop group and 2) Hitch should have had the sense to realize that Torn Curtain required a Herrmann sound rather than something that could sell LPs.
A similar thing happened between Hawks and Tiomkin on Hatari!. Hawks was souring on orchestral scoring altogether. He asked Tiomkin for a score that didn't use an orchestra! Tiomkin was baffled on what to do and was fired. Hawks hired Henry Mancini to get the kind of jazz scoring that Mancini had done for Peter Gunn and Breakfast at Tiffanys. But in that case Hawks's instincts were right and the results were great. I love Tiomkin but I don't think he would have come up with the Baby Elephant Walk no matter how hard he tried. Perhaps Hitchcock had something similar in mind or atleast Hitchcock's bosses did (it seems that during the 60s everybody suddenly hated the Herrmann sound). But it couldn't work for Hitchcock as well as it did for Hawks. Torn Curtain was a weaker Hitchcock film to begin with so it needed all it could get and in the end by dumping Herrmann it didn't get it.
As for Joy in the Morning, it's a neat little film and it's great that there is Herrmann in there. The score might have echoes of Vertigo and Marnie but at least Herrmann put a little body into the score so that it's still a "joy" to listen to.
A postscript: I've noticed that not only did I do this but other reviewers too. It's hard to knock Herrmann. Even when Herrmann does something second tier, it's still Herrmann, and the love for this guy's music makes it difficult to criticize it even when it's not top-notch. And there's peer pressure--not that I would bow to it
--so that the minute you say, well, that TV score wasn't so hot, someone comes out of the shadows to say, what are you using for brains this season, that was terrific stuff. And then you are fighting a Herrmann lover who is really on the same side as you are. On the flip side, "weaker" Herrmann can still grab you. I'll play the Outer Space Suite of library cues and think it's still more enjoyable to listen to these stunted puppies than it is half the stuff on my shelf. Go figure.posted 03-09-2003 09:31 PM PT (US) 
Luscious Lazlo

Romulan

Lou Goldberg said: "I'll play the OUTER SPACE SUITE of library cues and think it's still more enjoyable to listen to these stunted puppies than it is half the stuff on my shelf."Don't hit me for saying this, but those stunted puppies mean more to me than VERTIGO. I prefer that sparsely instrumented chamber music to his full-orchestral lushwerks. But I found out that the limited instrumentation wasn't Herrmann's choice. According to Bill Wrobel: "Herrmann was required to conform to a previously set orchestral guideline for this already started outer space theme music."
posted 03-10-2003 07:51 AM PT (US) 
Lou Goldberg

Romulan

LL--I think you just proved my point about knocking lesser Herrmann only to be confronted by someone who thinks you're crazy for doing so
Actually, I absolutely love the Outer Space Suite, but you gotta admit they're knock offs, Herrmann composed these with his left foot between 4 and 6 some Sunday afternoon while he was doing other chores. Or maybe their illusion of simplicity is the result of incredible and excruciating effort, to paraphrase a line from The Red Shoes. Who knows?
posted 03-10-2003 10:28 PM PT (US) 
John C Winfrey

Romulan

I also like his Hitchhiker and Moat Farm Murders radio scores. Some of this was used on Hitchcock Presents and in Twilight Zone. Great stuff. J.
posted 03-14-2003 04:07 PM PT (US) Old Infopop Software by UBB
