Thoughts anyone?

Williams did a fantastic job last night!!! I'd welcome his return next year. Give Tom Conti a rest

Erik

John Williams? Ego-centric?

How preposterous!

Or Bill Conti:
"The Right Stuff? Rocky? There were plenty of scores he could have picked that were better than this dreck. How egocentric."

Just be glad LOTR won Best Score.

I really liked the suite personally.

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Originally posted by JJH:
[B]John Williams wrote the most memorable movie scores of that last 25 years. to have NOT included his own stuff for the masses would have been dumb.

Just be glad LOTR won Best Score.

[B]

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I am not even remotely shocked by Alex North being slighted as his music is very hard to into and not easily recognizable to the average moviegoer.

You guys would complain no matter what pieces were chosen. Instead of being glad that movie music was exposed to the largest possible audience last night, you’re complaining about the selections, which were mostly appropriate, to a more mainstream audience.

Sometimes I really wonder about the priorities around here. The more people who warm to movie music, the easier it will be to get releases.

Personally, I thought it was great. I thought it was great when Titanic sold huge numbers. Sure, people picked it up to get Celine Deon, but some of them, a few of them, liked the score and maybe tried some others. I just hope they didn’t go to the internet to talk about Titanic or we would shooed them away by telling them how pedestrian the score was or how it sucked because of Horner’s self referential cribs and how anyone who like that score was lacking in taste.

Oh well, such is human nature I guess!

just a couple of quibbles...

Bridge On The River Kwai with a picture of Malcolm Arnold....Colonel Bogey WASN'T written by Malcolm Arnold, what a shame they didn't play Arnold's music!

Max Steiner didn't write 'As Time Goes By' in Casablanca.

NP : Flash Gordon - Howard Blake

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Originally posted by Timmer:
[BBridge On The River Kwai with a picture of Malcolm Arnold....Colonel Bogey WASN'T written by Malcolm Arnold, what a shame they didn't play Arnold's music!

Max Steiner didn't write 'As Time Goes By' in Casablanca.[/B]

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According to the Oscar website, they were presented as "Music Adapted by...." They never said composed by.

You must remember that the themes the ignorant masses remember just happen to be the most bombastic themes for the most bombastic movies of all time. The box office forerunners. Most of these have been scored by Williams. STAR WARS, JAWS,E.T., RAIDERS, JURASSIC PARK. It's these themes they will remember from these popcorn movies. They all have strong themes, memborable themes, the masses have not only heard in the theatre, but at their amusement parks, their fireworks shows. They know the themes. Could hum them. Tell you what movie they are from. Sadly, they don't know the man's name.

It's kind of a nice little payback for the composer with the most popular themes of all time to finally have his name put on screen with him conducting his own famous pieces.

Of course,even then, ignoramuses like Whoopi Goldberg won't acknowledge this fact during the ceremony... so, I don't know, people might for once remember the maesto's name and connect it with his music that they so adore. (Although, amazingly, she said something about Randy Newman's finally winning. That's a start, I guess.)

You must remember that the themes the ignorant masses remember just happen to be the most bombastic themes for the most bombastic movies of all time. The box office forerunners. Most of these have been scored by Williams. STAR WARS, JAWS,E.T., RAIDERS, JURASSIC PARK. It's these themes they will remember from these popcorn movies. They all have strong themes, memborable themes, the masses have not only heard in the theatre, but at their amusement parks, their fireworks shows. They know the themes. Could hum them. Tell you what movie they are from. Sadly, they don't know the man's name.

They are "ignorant masses" because they don't know about film music? What does that make us but a bunch of cliquish freaks who would rather spend time waxing orgasmic over the latest John Williams/Jerry Goldsmith score and ranting about James Horner self plagiarism than mixing with the Hoi Polloi?

You know, being a film score fan doesn’t exactly alleviate us to some refined plateau that only the worthy can approach. It makes us enthusiasts in tiny niche market that we are incredibly lucky anyone bothers servicing at all. I love film music, but it isn’t a license to dismiss the tastes and interests of the entire world as dross and beneath we Olympian giants who ‘get’ film music.

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Originally posted by André Lux:

Even John Williams applauded Howard Shore.
A great artist obviously recognizes his peer!

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Next year the winning composer and all composer nominees for best original score and musical number will be BLACK!!!!

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Originally posted by jeffy:
Well, what did you expect him to do...moon him?

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Hummmm... good idea.
That would be even better, Jeffy!

Thanks for input and various sarcasm all.

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Originally posted by jeffy:
Well, what did you expect him to do...moon him?

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Lol!!! That would have been so funny!!!

And Aaron: you're so wrong. Shore should have won for Lambs (not even a nomination) - his contribution was at least as important a contribution to the success of that film as those that did win for the film (yes, including Hopkins). Shores music was ever present but never drawing attention to itself. It's a huge, bleak, compellingly dark score that provides the mood and atmosphere of the film - in a sense it almost is the film, & it just wouldn't work half as well without him. Compare it with Hannibal - Zimmers' score did nothing really. You can lay all the blame you want at the script, but one of the biggest factors working against Hannibal was the fact the absence of Shores' music.
It works really well on disc. Like the majority of Shores work, it's difficult to get into, & doesn't provide a quick, easy fix - which is probably which a lot of people don't like it. That's their problem - I say let them have their MV scores, or their big Williams melodies. Shores music needs investment from the listener - it needs work, but the payback on it is enormous. Once it gets its grips into you, there's no getting out of it, & it's incredibly addictive. Shore is one of the most distinctive & underrated (although Rings has rectified that a little) composers working today, & the oscar was richly deserved. Here's hoping he can pull it off next year and the year after!!!

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Originally posted by Lightborne:
Exactly,cine-sin.

You must remember that the themes the ignorant masses remember just happen to be the most bombastic themes for the most bombastic movies of all time. The box office forerunners. Most of these have been scored by Williams. STAR WARS, JAWS,E.T., RAIDERS, JURASSIC PARK. It's these themes they will remember from these popcorn movies. They all have strong themes, memborable themes, the masses have not only heard in the theatre, but at their amusement parks, their fireworks shows. They know the themes. Could hum them. Tell you what movie they are from. Sadly, they don't know the man's name.

It's kind of a nice little payback for the composer with the most popular themes of all time to finally have his name put on screen with him conducting his own famous pieces.

Of course,even then, ignoramuses like Whoopi Goldberg won't acknowledge this fact during the ceremony... so, I don't know, people might for once remember the maesto's name and connect it with his music that they so adore. (Although, amazingly, she said something about Randy Newman's finally winning. That's a start, I guess.)

Eric.

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Yes, but A LOT OF PEOPLE know Randy Newman as he is a successful pop music artist. People also know Danny Elfman and Trevor Rabin as well because they were successful pop music artists LONG before they scored film.

Randy also comes from a family that is the equivalent of Film Scoring royalty. So when you mention Howard Shore, Basil P and a few others, to most people they are not familiar names (even though Shore started his career working with Elton John and was the original band leader on SNL) thus the "snubs".

John Williams, and to a lesser extent, Jerry Goldsmith and Bernard Herrmann are a little better known because of the familiarity of their work with the masses. John Williams has just about cornered the market on memorable scores to BIG movies. Goldsmith is known at least for the Omen and work on his 80s scores to BIG movies. Herrmann is best remembered as the guy who did the memorable piece of music from PSYCHO.

C'mon, I love film and film music, I also know the better known (and lesser in some cases) cinematographers, directors, special effects and score people. Most of the public can't even remember who the last Vice President was or their congressman let alone who composed what piece of music in any given film. Shoot, most Americans have no clue about basic history and think people like Britney Spears are MUSICIANS for god sakes.

Whether or not Whoopi Goldberg knows composers is not relevant to me as the "Hollywood" types (actors, A-List producers, studio heads) haven't much clues as it is. I never expect ANYBODY to know this stuff. When somebody does, it always makes me take notice.

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Originally posted by Lightborne:
It has nothing to do with being a dignified film score snob or knowing all the composers names. The ignorance has to do with being aware of what the hell is going on around you. Why were we so quick to jump on Julia Robert's case a few posts ago? That ignorance. See, the presenters have to go by a teleprompter. Whoopee, as emcee, decides what she says and since she or any emcee feels the need to comment on many things, I feel that they should be aware of the program and perhaps basic history of the freakin' thing they are emceeing. It's not hard. Is that too much to ask?

It's like that recent Alan Jackson song that talks about "I don't know the difference between Iraq and Iran." It's just being aware of basic things going on around you. Why is such ignorance forgiven so easily? I don't thing it's asking too much acknowledging the most popular film composer of all time especially when he is conducting at an awards program for FILM that you are emceeing!!!!

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No, I wasn't so much saying that as I was trying to make this point: Who cares??? It's a freaking actor for god sakes...Trust me, the composers DON'T care about Whoopee or Julia. They work non-stop and get paid nicely for it. To a lot of people the composer is like the cinematographer, editor, special effects dude, sound guy, etc. They are background players that help their efforts and that is it. I am not defending this kind of thinking, but trust me us film music fans are the only people sitting around discussing this.

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Originally posted by MWRuger:
The whole point of the piece was to remind people about movie music and how great it is, not please a few thousand fans.

You guys would complain no matter what pieces were chosen. Sometimes I really wonder about the priorities around here.

The more people we bring in the better. It is snobbery and elitism to preserve this music for the “enlightened” and serve up disdain for the “masses” who “don’t get it”. We need them more than they need us.

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I agree with some of the things you say. Not everyone is going to be pleased. My statement was said in haste and I should have reminded myself of two things:

1. This is the oscars
2. 3 minute sequence compared to other sequences

However, my suggestion has nothing to do with elitism or snobbery and I think you went on a different tangent there. All, I was trying to suggest was that (ideally) there could have been a larger range of composers showcased - which does not mean that overall mass appeal need be reduced.

Regards,
Rochelle

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Originally posted by Lightborne:
Exactly,cine-sin.

You must remember that the themes the ignorant masses remember just happen to be the most bombastic themes for the most bombastic movies of all time. The box office forerunners.
Eric.

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Well, I guess so.

Its like I said, I should have reminded myself that I was watching the Oscars afterall.

Finally, I have to say - it is nice to have a showcase for film scores themselves.