Linda Ronstadt: DREAMS TO DREAM (An American Tail: Fievel Goes West) Horner & Jennings

Huey Lewis: ONCE UPON A TIME IN NEW YORK CITY (Oliver & Company) Mann & Ashman

Jon Secada & Shanice: IF I NEVER KNEW YOU (Pocahontas) Menken & Schwartz

Tom Hulce: OUT THERE (The Hunchback of Notre Dame) Menken & Schwartz

Liz Callaway: JOURNEY TO THE PAST (Anastasia) Ahrens & Flaherty

Bryan White: I STAND ALL ALONE (The Magic Sword: The Quest for Camelot) Foster & Bayer Sager

Jordan Hill: REMEMBER ME THIS WAY (Casper) Foster & Thompson

David Bowie: AS THE WORLD FALLS DOWN (Labyrinth) Bowie

Eric Carmen: ALL BY MYSELF (To Die For) Carmen (- well, I don't know for sure is this an original movie song, but anyway... )

Martina McBride: WHEN LOVE IS GONE (The Muppet Christmas Carol) P.Williams

Lea Salonga: REFLECTION (Mulan) Wilder & Zippel

Roger Bart: GO THE DISTANCE (Hercules) Menken & Zippel

...Well, I think you got the point .
Without these songs I probably would not survived during some very desperate periods of my young life. So, HOW ABOUT YOU ? DO YOU HAVE A SONG OR MANY SONGS - or instrumental movie music, if you prefer - THAT HAS GIVEN YOU STRENGHT TO COPE WITH LIFE ?

Sally Stevens: FLYING DREAMS (The Secret of N.I.M.H.) Goldsmith

Maureen McGovern: CAN YOU READ MY MIND (Superman) John Williams/Leslie Bricusse

Art Garfunkel: BRIGHT EYES AND INTERLUDE (Watership Down) Mike Batt/Angela Morley

Randy Newman: YOU'VE GOT A FRIEND IN ME (Toy Story)

Chorus: YOU'LL NEVER WALK ALONE (Carousel) Rogers & Hammerstein

K.T. Vogt: WASHU'S LULLABY (Tenchi Muyo! Ryo-ohki)

Minako Obata: THERE'LL NEVER BE GOOD-BYE (Metropolis -- the upcoming anime film) Toshiyuki Honda

"The Rainbow Connection - Kermit the Frog, "I'm Going to Go Back There Someday" - The Great Gonzo, The Muppet Movie

"Sigh No More, Ladies" - Balthazar, Much Ado About Nothing

"History Lesson" - The Beepers, WarGames

"That's All I've Got to Say" - Lir, The Last Unicorn

"Who Wants to Live Forever" - Queen, Highlander

"Through Heaven's Eyes" - Jethro,The Prince of Egypt

"As Time Goes By" - Sam, Casablanca

"Bright Eyes" from Watership Down. There's nothing to say, because I don't know where to start. If I've ever worn out an LP by playing one track too much, this one's it. This song plain wrecks me.

Lancelot: GOOD choice on "The Rainbow Connection!" I knew there was something I forgot! "The Magic Store/Rainbow Connection Reprise" from the same movie is even more poignant in my book. Come to think of it, "I'm Going To Go Back There Someday" is also wonderfully moving. What a great film ...

There's not a word yet
For old friends who've just met.

Lancelot - you're right! Up There (Satan, the dark Prince) is great!

However my all-time best song from a film award has to go to 'Les poissons' from The Little Mermaid

:shrugs: Guess I got too much starch in my shirt this morning.

A peculiarly haunting little film from 1969, called The Adding Machine, starring Milo O'Shea & Billie Whitelaw, featured an equally peculiar and haunting song called, "How Small We Are; How Little We Know".

When you (Wedge) say philosophical, I jump to the very Greek origins of the word, "love of knowledge". Now, if what you want "Emotionally stirring", well, that's something else. Not that knowledge can't be emotionally stirring....however....that a song has something really profound to say--that it makes a point, it says something poetic that causes us to examine the nature of our existance or the existance of nature. That is how I interpret "philosophical". It can be humorous, as well, as Al Capone said in The Untouchables, "We laugh because it's funny, and we laugh because it's true."

Humor is truth and juxtaposition. Because Satan's lament is "out of the ordinary", or not exactly what you were expecting, it's funny. But, there's also something it says about the definitions of Good and Evil, and the extremes at which some people tend to place them. Perhaps this is better observed within the context of the actual South Park film, however, my intent in placing, yes, was to get a laugh, albeit brief, but also very sincerely to observe that flowery love-and-life songs aren't only the examples of philosophy.

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Originally posted by Lancelot:
That is how I interpret "philosophical". It can be humorous, as well ... Because Satan's lament is "out of the ordinary", or not exactly what you were expecting, it's funny. But, there's also something it says about the definitions of Good and Evil, and the extremes at which some people tend to place them.

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Oh, make no mistake, I agree with you about humour! And "Up There" is funny, if just for the absurd idea of the Prince of Darkness singing a romantic ballad.

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But, there's also something it says about the definitions of Good and Evil, and the extremes at which some people tend to place them.

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And this is where I'll have to disagree. Good and Evil are related alright, but not in the way Satan proposes. Humorous as it may be, the philosophical idea behind the song has zero merit. You could, I suppose, interpret it as a satire on people who justify evil as somehow "right," but even then, you'd be stretching to call it "philosophy."

and there is a serious philosophical point to consider

in order to have good evil must exit to differntiate it thus isnt it then good that there is evil...
is judas to blame after all if judas had done the good thing then what would have happened to all the good jesus did...

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Originally posted by Dr. Zaius:
and there is a serious philosophical point to consider ... in order to have good evil must exit to differntiate it thus isnt it then good that there is evil ... anyway i think you probably meant uplifting in the conventional sense when you said philosphical

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No, philosophy is definitely not always uplifting. But the argument you describe is an intrinsically flawed, if common, philosophical mistake.

For example: cold does not exist. Neither does dark. Cold is just a term we use to describe a smaller amount of heat. Dark is the absence of light, NOT it's opposite.

Think about it: everything that you consider "evil" is, in reality, a perversion of something good. Lust is an imbalance of love. Greed is an imbalance of hunger. Sloth is an imbalance of relaxation. Think of evil like a parasite. It cannot exist without first having something good to be a corruption of. If good is a body, evil is a disease. The body doesn't NEED the disease in order to exist. But the disease can't survive without the host.

"...even wit a good beginning, it's not soitan dat yer winning!"

Cold may be the absence of heat.
Dark may be the absence of light.
Though, in scientific terms, heat is classified as a scalar (magnitude) and light is vector (magnitude and direction.)

Love is not the opposite of Hate.

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Originally posted by Lancelot:
Opposing forces (in this case, Good and Evil, both scalars) are not equated by intensity of a single concept. They simply co-exist....

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I disagree. I guess we'll have to leave it at that. I just can't imagine evil as an "opposing force" -- that is to say, people are out there being evil for the sake of evilness. Goodness gone wrong I can imagine. A "foundation" of evil ... well, I can't see how it can exist.

When Jesus fasted 40 days in the wilderness, Satan tempted Him to fall three times.

Again, I'm not trying to start an argument, just stating my religion's basic theology. It goes deeper, and if it raises questions, I can assure you there are answers (there ought to be after millenia of debate!) But that's roughly where I'm coming from. If your world-view has a different definition of the relationship between will, nature, order, etc., then I suppose you would think differently.

Suffice it to say that I'm uncomfortable with any philosophy that tells me evil is justified.

what do you think of this:

1.evil is not justified

2.people have free will and some people chose evil (for example murder their children so can be with new boyfriend)

another example Iaccoca and the ford execs calculated costs of fixing pinto versus lawsuits tehy would pay out once people started dying and being injured and realized cheaper to release product knowing t woud maim and kill

these 2 things are evil in an of themselves

3.because some people chose evil we know what good is... if no one did evil we would not KNOW what good is It would just be the "way things are"

4. the key is we know what is evil because people do evil

That said, hasn't it suprised you (gentle reader) how much...philosophizing...has occured over the discussion/debate of the validity of a song--actually, a single lyric line(!)--that has appeared in a Philosophical Movie Song post? I notice a lot of Disney and/or other Animated Musical songs that preceed my own contribution, as well....even a tune by the Master of Sardonic/Sarcastic verse, Randy Newman....

All aside though, I'm not questioning anyone's choice(s)....though I do have some questions about philosophical impact of "Can You Read My Mind", which discusses "holding hands with a god" and being "such a fool".

....Probably has the same implications as Weber's "I Don't Know How To Love Him", both of which observe the metaphorical demi-God Type or Archetype....end digression....

Having appeared in South Park (clue #1), the Dark Prince's soliloquy is perhaps oversimplified without being simplistic....The fact that it is being dismissed because it appeared in a movie made by guys who marketed a singing turd...well...that's kind of confusing the message with the source. (Another problem that plagues organized religion...)

The point, perhaps as in Zen philosophy-- because, as anyone who watches South Park knows: God is a Buddhist and only Mormons get into Heaven--is not to provide an answer, but to ponder the question (i.e., What is the relationship of Good to Evil? I'll take Crappy Animation Metaphysics for $600, Alex.)

Within the context of the film, what is the source of evil? Hint: It's not Satan.

Ok, not embarking on a South Park analysis, here...plenty of time for that later. It's just that if it gives us pause to reflect (and perhaps even laugh at ourselves), it may fall within the realm of philosophical...

These ideas are at once simple and hard to explain. God simply IS. He is not subject to capricious choices. Our definitions of Good and Evil do not apply to him, because they only exist relative to Him. God IS, God could not be any other way, there is and can be no wrongness or imperfection in Him by very definition: and therefore we call God GOOD.

What, then, is EVIL? There is no context for it of itself. We can only describe it in terms of its relationship to good. Look at how psychologists approach "evil" people. Someone who hates uncontrollably has has "lost control of their anger." A rapist or child molester is described as "perverted" -- that is to say, his or her feelings have been twisted from their original purpose. At the root of every evil, a psycho-analyst can tell you which good impulses have gone bad. It's the only way we know how to define them.

The words HEALTHY and UNHEALTHY are instructive. For example: eating too many sweets is unhealthy ... but only in the sense that you have something healthy to compare it to. It doesn't work the other way around. Eating the right amount of sweets is healthy because it works to maintain the natural balance of our bodies. Healthy cannot be defined as "not unhealthy." That's circular and pointless. Under that definition, tapping my finger against my knee at random intervals could be considered "healthy."

PS - Dr. Zauis: don't apologize! We were just waiting for the opening. Besides, so far it's been friendly and open dialogue. Let's not discourage people to stop posting about their favorite philosophical songs, however! KEEP POSTING, PEOPLE! STOP RUBBERNECKING! B)

"Haunting" is a different thing: the list is endless, but Harry Robinson's spine-chilling adaptation of "Ladybird, Ladybird" in a pretty bad 70s British film (what WAS that?) was bloody well haunting as hell:

"Ladybird, ladybird
Fly away home
Your house is on fire
Your children are gone"

Christ on a bike!

And I quite like the last track on Ennio's Legend of 1900, Roger Waters singing "You never took us fishing Dad, and now you never will."

Edmund Burke said "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for
good men to do nothing." That doesn't imply that Good becomes Evil when it does nothing. There is an implication that all men are capable of recognizing Evil.

Albert Schweitzer's reverence for life revolves around an idea that Good is whatever promotes life. Evil is whatever destroys it. Even so, Life will always co-exist with Death. Death is not evil, though Evil is what prevents life from expressing its' diversity and expansion. Would the elimination of a bacteria that causes infection be considered Evil? Would eliminating all the Jewish people from the Earth be considered Evil?

Osmosis Jones aside, as we know it, Bacteria do not have free will. Humans do. Hitler could have said, "Well, I won't promote the Jewish faith" and left it at that. (Would that be considered "Good"? Would it be a lack of "Good"?) But rather a sad deciscion was made to attempt to extinguish the entire race and faith.

Homework assignment: Go listen to William's Schindler's List. There, I tied in film music. More later....

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Originally posted by Lancelot:
I ... don't see it possible to define Evil as the lack of Good, because there is the possibility of a person who does Good also doing an Evil thing.

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Um ... I fail to see the logic behind that line of reasoning. By my argument, a person who is capable of doing good is also capable of doing something evil. Just because you usually moderate your temper doesn't mean it doesn't sometimes get the better of you.

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Would the elimination of a bacteria that causes infection be considered Evil?

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Not under most circumstances.

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Would eliminating all the Jewish people from the Earth be considered Evil?

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Yes. What's your point?

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Hitler could have said, "Well, I won't promote the Jewish faith" and left it at that. (Would that be considered "Good"?)

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You're missing the point. Hitler perceived injustices and wanted to correct them -- this can be a positive thing. But his misdirection of his anger and his inability to accept truth led to the corruption of his intentions and made possible greater evils.

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Originally posted by Lancelot:
I'm having trouble (surprise) with the concept that the universe is defined like a cosmic speedometer with 0, at one end, 100 at the other.

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No metaphor is perfect, especially when you try to extend it indefinitely.

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Newtonian law suggests that the universe operates on equal-but-opposing forces.

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To a small extent, I agree with what your saying, via the context of one of my favorite Good/Evil allegories:

Darth Vader (e.g.) is Corrupted Good. The Emperor is Evil. The balance, like everything in nature, sways back and forth. At the beginning of Episode One, things seem Utopian. The prevailing Good seems to think Well, as we'll learn by Episode Four, the shift has changed again. By the end of Episode Six, the balance has changed again. Because the Emperor has been destroyed, has all evil been irradicated from the universe? Naah. In another hundred years or so, there will be another shift. But it won't be a well-intentioned Darth Vader, it'll be a Totalitarian/Ethnic Cleansing Emperor.

Aaaahhh...anyway, what I'm saying is: There is evil for evil's sake. (It may be an abhoration, but it's there.) There is also evil for good's sake. It is not necessary, that on opposing sides of a bipolar conflict, one side be completely good and the other side be completely evil--(i.e., Republicans/Democrats, Smokers/Non-Smokers, Goldsmith/Zimmer...whatever, you get the picture)--often this is never the case, except in stories. Usually, what is Evil is the means by which conflict is waged. (e.g., Crimson Tide: "In the nuclear world, the true enemy is war itself.")