The average price for CDs was $18.99 - $19.99. Since I have all but stopped buying music locally, I had to be careful that I did not laugh out loud. I guess these places like Sam Goody and Suncoast pray on the stupid casual buyer. Anyone with a computer could easily find what they wanted and save themselves $5 easily if not more. It makes you really appreciate the efforts at Prometheus and FSM. I used to think $20 was a bargain given the nature of what they were providing, I think it's a steal now.

Forget about people who know much about music beyond the top 40 working in the store. Sometimes its blatantly obvious that alphabetizing and arranging product is beyond comprehension for the staff in these places. And forget about those old treasure trove "cut-out" bins.

It's hard to believe that there are kids out there shelling out the equivalent of 4 hours working cash after taxes for a cd they will get $5 tops for when they try to sell it back to a used store--probably within the month.

The Tower in our area has good staff, but again prices there are nothing to get excited about. The staff hover around you hoping you will buy something!

.....
Then there's DVD prices which are so blatantly fixed that it out to be a federal crime. There appears to be no rhyme or reason to the costs of these things either. It is unbelievably frustrating to try to decide if you are getting an "old classic" restored or just copied to DVD from a tape or, hopefully a master copy. And we are being asked to shell out the same for a 50 year old film that the studio has made its money off of that we would for the dreck that we currently get out of the theater. I mean, unless you love Mystery Science Theater and can reproduce the humor in your own living room, is it really necessary to have something like "Supernova" for posterity? Is it any wonder that videotapes are still selling well?

Don't get me wrong, I love the medium of DVD, and I think it has great potential. But studios and big name conglomerates are nuts if they think they can sustain their market with people shelling out $25-50 for the score CD and a DVD. Even in a boom economy.

I think FSM and Prometheus prices are on target. They always give "the full treatment" to a score with a great presentation all around. I've got a bunch of FSM discs on my "wish list," but it all comes down to the wallet.

I agree that the DVD prices are lame, too. I don't own a DVD player yet, but I think the fake inflation for these discs is awful. I'm sure mastering the discs takes a good amount of money, but the DVD platters must be much easier to produce and cheaper than VHS tapes.

Sure, a lot of the new releases here at MM are $16.99. It does really suck, but it's the recording industry's fault. They are charging near $15.00 wholesale to retailers! If the RIAA really wanted to do something about NAPSTER, why don't they get their labels to do good on their promise to lower CD prices (a 10+ year promise)? I hardly think Napster would be a "problem" if new CDs were no more than thirteen bucks.

What is a retailer like MM supposed to do? My personal perspective suggests most people will buy the popular new stuff at the Amazons and CDNOWs of the world, but when it comes to older CDs and label back catalogs, this is where MM will succeed. Most older releases (except for a specific line of Varese CDs) slowly fall in price until they reach $11.97 or so. This is indeed what has been happening here.

Now, next line of business:

One of the next big things to come to MM will be the used CD store. All discs (aside from rare or limited editions, etc.) will run $6.99 plus shipping. The best part about it will be the opportunity for collectors to exchange their old CDs for MM store credit. At this point, it looks like we'll be able to give $4 for every CD deemed acceptable.

What do you guys think of something like this? The only thing cool about living in Los Angeles are the used CD stores. Tons and tons of them. Now the internet is here, this kind of store should virtually exist anywhere, and for our niche, MM is the perfect place for this kind of thing. Ideas, ideas? What do you think? I like it. Personally, I want to build a store that the community members will actively use. It's been a little bit of a disappointment to look through the hundreds and hundres of orders placed at MM, only to see a few have been from the community.

Ford Thaxton once emailed me privately, telling he would lurk here and send emails to everyone telling them to shop elsewhere... perhaps it's working, I don't know. I would like to make something all of you would LIKE to use, something you find very valuable (however, I am not about to start a CDR business!).

NP- The Caveman's Valentine (Terence Blanchard)

I order through the mail, but that doesn't really save me any real money when you add postage and sales tax.

I get used stuff where I can but a lot has to be paid full $ for. If I had a burner I suppose I'd find a trading partner or two to offset our costs.

In the meantime, back to the coal mine.....

By the way, the used CD store is an excellent idea - it involves lower prices and you've certainly got the customer base right here. The only trick will be keeping prices in line. The real value of used stores is finding good stuff CHEAP, not inflated, e-bay "RARE SOUNDTRACK!" prices. I once found "Body Heat" used for $8.99 That's what we're all looking for.

Hope this is helpful - and, by the way, thanks for hosting this board.

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Why waste your time with moviemusic.com store when there are better alternatives

Other then amazon.de and such you can try these, better service and better
prices.

Also you can try: http://www.cdjapan.co.jp/search.html

There are also a number of online sevices out there that are just better
alround.

Pass on the information.

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Included an extensive list of various "alternative" stores.

Of course, this won't stop me from buying at MM.com when Peter offers international shipping. The used CD concept is a great idea, by the way.

Why do so many websites link to Amazon? Probably because Amazon offers partnership programs, i.e. if somebody clicks the link on your homepages and buys the CD, you get a small amount of money for making them buy it at Amazon. Why Amazon and not other stores (CDNow offers these programs to, e.g. one of the John Williams sites links to them rather than Amazon)? Probably because Amazon is best known. Or perhaps they pay better.

Varčse I'll get where I live. Much cheaper if bought within the first month.

Marco Polo, Intrada, and some others, I'll get from MM, Intrada, or Screen Archives.

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I'd like to know what is the big deal about Amazon.com? Every soundtrack reviewer has links only to that store site. And there are aways people saying "you can order that online at Amazon.com." I means what the bid deal with them? they don't even have decent coupons!

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I think it's because they were the first to become so popular.
They might also give the best "associates" percentages of sales generated through a web site.
And, Amazon will likely be more trusted by people from around the world, than MM, Intrada, STAR, or SAE.

and I bought it on gift certificate, too.

Other stores, to me, are worth paying a bit more for timely service.
Nothing is more annoying than having to wait weeks for something you ordered, that you know isn't rare or OOP yet.

Intrada, FSM, and MovieMusic have been good to me so far.

every great once in a while I'll get a CD at one of those high-priced stores, out of impulse and immediate gratification (I'm vain, okay?). Heck, 15.99 online plus 3 bucks shipping and the added wait. Where's the savings in that scenario?

oh well.

The phantom quoter has oviously never ordered from MM, as MM customer service is far better than most major online outlets. I would suggest for anyone to try it out for themselves if you have concerns. I am beginning to work with current customers and BizRate.com to certify the comments being received from customers who have actually purchased from the store! Also, Marian, try putting something into your shopping cart and checking out, you will see some international shipping options (it's "quietly" available, just hasn't been announced yet...).

Mark T has some great points; I appreciate the honesty. Others are honest in different ways, and don't mind paying a buck more for a CD from a place they spend a lot of time interacting with others. But, to each is own, there won't be any price tag on the message boards anytime soon. However, the only thing that will bring down MM prices are more orders. It's a tough situation, I know. But, as long as there are people who don't mind paying $15 bucks for a CD along with $9 for Next Day Air, I throw my hands in the air. People walk to their own tune in life.

MM is contemplating a cool, permanent shipping deal. Order any 4 soundtracks and get $1 shipping - something like that. Is that more attractive? I think it might be for some people.

MovieMusic does have an affiliation program, just like Amazon's, CDNOW and others, which pays a percentage of sales or a "finder's fee" for every new customer signed up (which is a bonus, since the store just opened - nearly everyone is a new customer!). It's not publicly identified, because I don't want to have to hire 25 accountants to manage thousands of little websites that bring in two or three clicks a month. I've selectively picked the sites I'd like to give the opportunity to, as well as given the opportunity to whomever has asked. It's weird - while most movie sites I've approached really liked the idea of the MM site, none of the film music webmasters seemed to like the idea. Maybe Ford Thaxton again. Certain webmasters claimed the MM database of products sucked and wanted to have no part in it. That's fine. Personally, I am thinking the bigger problem lies in the fact that it takes a lot of time to manually link up over 2,700 soundtracks to MM to make it work, even with the link-generator script MM provides. Anyway, I let it be. It's hell enough to get ONE link on soundtrack sites - I am STILL working on some of these. Strange!

Anyway, is it just me or did new CD prices used to be around $13 BEFORE Napster? Interpret it how you will, but I tend to think that piece of **** called the recording industry is actually raising the price to combat Internet/downloadable music.

quote:

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Originally posted by Norman McCay:
At the request of PeterK, I am posting something (I gotta thank PK for remembering old-timers like me).

Anyway, is it just me or did new CD prices used to be around $13 BEFORE Napster? Interpret it how you will, but I tend to think that piece of **** called the recording industry is actually raising the price to combat Internet/downloadable music.

Indeed, I have no hard facts to back up my statement, but I could honestly remember $13 for a brand new soundtrack (regardless of scarcity) four years ago, and now average prices for soundtracks have soared to $14.99 & above.

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You weren't dreaming, I remember when CDs where at least $14 back in '94 and before.

sakman, them's fightin' words!

Also, regarding DVD prices: I doubt the people who owned laserdiscs are complaining about prices. Sure, Apollo 13 is damned expensive at $35 on DVD. BUT, try paying $100 for the LASERDISC. Suddenly, a $65 price drop doesn't sound too bad. I could list about 30 DVDs that had equivalent LDs that were in the $100 price range.

Regarding the "phantom quoter", I think it's not too difficult to guess who he is. Or why he doesn't respond himself.

quote:

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Originally posted by TimT:
I'd like to know what is the big deal about Amazon.com? Every soundtrack reviewer has links only to that store site. And there are aways people saying "you can order that online at Amazon.com." I means what the bid deal with them? they don't even have decent coupons!

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I can't stand Amazon. I used to love buying from them... and then they screwed over my mother last Christmas (involving one of my presents ) (Is 30 days before Christmas enough time to order a book that ships "within 24 hours?" -- it wasn't in my mother's case. After a couple of weeks of waiting for the book to ship, she cancelled that order and ordered the book again [on Dec 17, with a $3 "get it before Christmas" shipping charge] and she received a shipping confirmation an HOUR after she submitted the second order. So, they appear to have some sort of an organizational problem. My book arrived the day after Christmas, so I wrote a letter to Amazon, and they refunded the $3 'fast shipping charge' and gave us a $5 gift certificate. Whoop-de-ding.)

I've never ordered from CDNow. I did order a few times with no problem from a site they bought a few years ago, Music Boulevard.

PeterK -- I'm glad to hear that MM will be getting some CDs that "aren't distributed through the majors." Does this mean Prometheus CDs? I know there are issues between Ford A. Thaxton and this site, but I know there also must be other people at that label who are above him.

Sure, some (a LOT) of the CDs not distributed through major channels are Ford productions, and we'll carry them in the store. If Ford wants to go around asking people to pass around negative news about MovieMusic.com, that's fine. It's a stupid game with enough room for only one "player." I am not gonna participate in that one. Could you imagine the wrath upon my email box the minute I type "MovieMusic.com will not carry Ford A. Thaxton CDs" in a public place? Ugh. I am not going to stoop. I don't have time to play the Thaxton game. If MovieMusic loses customers because of Ford's activities, so what? The people who interact in the film music community are the ones hurt in the end.

The difference in price between Laserdiscs and DVD's is illusory because of the installed userbase. Laserdisc never had the market penetration that DVD enjoys making the per unit cost on the discs much higher by necessity.

I know that there were many here who had laserdisc, myself included, but DVD player sales have long ago outstripped the total sales of Laserdisc players over the lifetime of the product and LD players were never really accepted except by videophiles.

The marketers who designed DVD marketing campaigns had it just right when he predicted that it would gain wider acceptance based purely on the fact that it was in the familiar 5” format of CDs.

But I do agree that if you were used to paying 39.95 for movies on LD you aren’t really upset with DVD prices.

quote:

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Originally posted by PeterK:
Retailers can elect to send copies back to the manufacturer or let them sell out on the shelves. Once the discontinue date has passed, no new copies are available for wholesale purchase. The record label usually ends up leaving them in a closet if they have any left (which they usually don't). Some labels like Varese (and Milan soon, keep your eyes peeled) will offer these through their website from time to time.

Sure, some (a LOT) of the CDs not distributed through major channels are Ford productions, and we'll carry them in the store. If Ford wants to go around asking people to pass around negative news about MovieMusic.com, that's fine. It's a stupid game with enough room for only one "player." I am not gonna participate in that one. Could you imagine the wrath upon my email box the minute I type "MovieMusic.com will not carry Ford A. Thaxton CDs" in a public place? Ugh. I am not going to stoop. I don't have time to play the Thaxton game. If MovieMusic loses customers because of Ford's activities, so what? The people who interact in the film music community are the ones hurt in the end.

Anyway.

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Why doesn't Ford want people to shop at MM.com?

I do think the used cd idea is great. Only thing would be to have a commitment to the integrity of the disc. I can't say I've found any major glitches yet on used cds, but that's because I can inspect them in the store. That would be my only concern for an on-line service.

I can see why those who have used laserdiscs think that DVDs are "better than" pricing. I personally do not buy that argument.

Since laserdiscs came out, media companies have consolidated. That means that a handful own the rights to a majority of product. This should bring the price down, right? Evidently not. One poor entertainment investment in one line causes the rest to go up. I mean, even books are outrageously priced these days to help support the inflated advances of the top 30-50 writers while often good books languish in the back of the store if they make it that far at all.

Sakman, the way the used store will work will prevent defective used CDs from entering the system. MM will have complete quality control and will only issue store credits based on the number of GOOD CDs that are provided. The only key to a successful used store is a constant supply of CDs from store visitors. If everyone here is only keen on building the largest CD collection in the world and is never willing to trade stuff in, it won't work.

By the way, don't try and build the hugest collection in the world. It's a pain, and you only really listen to 3 or 4 hundred soundtracks on a regular basis anyway.

When does it start?

quote:

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Originally posted by PeterK:
Could you imagine the wrath upon my email box the minute I type "MovieMusic.com will not carry Ford A. Thaxton CDs" in a public place? Ugh. I am not going to stoop. I don't have time to play the Thaxton game. If MovieMusic loses customers because of Ford's activities, so what? The people who interact in the film music community are the ones hurt in the end.

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I think my last post may have been interpreted wrong... I was asking more specifically about if the Prometheus releases would be carried -- I know there are Ford A. Thaxton soundtracks in every movie music store. I really do enjoy some of his efforts (even the ones that sound like crap,) I just can't stand the guy's attitude.

For the used CD store, just make sure it's possible to sort them via composer! (I know this is a given, but most of the other used sites have all of their soundtracks listed as Artist: Original Soundtrack and it annoys the hell out of me.)

quote:

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Originally posted by Marian Schedenig:
Peter, great to hear international shipping is already available!

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It is? Why did no-one tell me? Or have I been asleep again (that can't be it, since I can't sleep )
Guess I'll have to order something then. Or I will when I have my credit card with me.

quote:

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Originally posted by Shaun Rutherford:
I love the idea of buying used CDs, but for some reason, I can't even stand the thought of trading in (or throwing away) CDs. Even my soundtrack to Once Were Warriors has something redeeming enough to warrant my storing it somewhere I'll never bother to see it (it was even hellish trading in my old Varese Taxi Driver and Mercury Vertigo a little while back).
Shaun

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And to say something about DVD's, I'll point out that I buy almost all my DVD's from Amazon.com (and some through Buy.com). The online prices beat the local ones anyday. I have yet to buy a DVD locally.

But the prices are high. I remember (being as old as I am) when CD's first came to market, there was the big talk about how they are so inexpensive to make, and prices would stay the same or go down (heck, I remember buying the 3-disc LP of Emerson, Lake & Palmer Live for $12.99!). Guess what? Prices haven't gone down, and I think it's the greediness of the companies and the PTB (powers that be).

When I have money to spend online for soundtracks, I will buy from MM.com (unless PK doesn't stock it). My loyalties are here, no matter what certain overbearing, self-important people have to say. Okay... I'm talking about Ford.

quote:

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Originally posted by wistiti:
Sorry, Peter, same here. I hate to trade or sell any of my CDs. I'm not trying to build a huge collection, but once I have a CD, I like keeping it. Even if I hate it. Occasionally I might listen to it. Or it might just sit and gather dust. But once it's in, it never leaves.[/B]

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Exactly.

I am basically an online shopper myself, and while I like the convenience it offers us, it has quickly become more of an hassle in the last year. Having to spend the least amount I can has stopped me from buying from places that could help improve the experience, such as MM.com, Intrada and Screen Archives. However, I can't tell you how close I am ready to do so though, with the way prices have been lately! It used to be an concern of mine devoted directly to retail stores, now it seems it is more universal than I thought.

I have said it before, and I'll say it again. retail stores, have continually shot themselves in the foot, by having such unreasonable prices. Just go to any number of stores, and look how many are at either MSRP, or even higher than it. I do realize that it is not just their fault, since the studios, labels and distributors all want an piece of the profit. Though, when they do nothing about trying to get online shoppers to come and buy from them, well it is insane.

I find this all to be ridiculous if you ask me! Truthfully, with online having been so good in the past with prices, I was hoping it would get the rest to lower prices, as an way to compete for our money. However, with online businesses having so many troubles these days, it looks like retail won't need to change for the most part. In fact, if it gets any worse, I expect prices to be pretty much identical from both web and retail stores. Not good IMO!

Anyway, I don't think many if any are worth more than $20 myself. If we are talking about promo', boots or imports, that is another matter altogether. However, for regular titles like Gladiator no way. What do you find is a reasonable price? I actually do have an system, no more than $14.99 online, and no more than $18.99 retail. Since, I rarely buy at retail stores these days, doing so on occasion is not much an problem. This is not counting those limited edition promo' and whatnot. Though, in most cases this works for me.

What I feel is needed though is an amount of consistency within the price structures of these releases. You know, something like $10 for 30 minutes CD', and $17 for 70 minute ones. If this were to happen, I believe that the prices would become more reasonable. It's funny in a way if you ask me. You would think if something like Napster was as much an problem as the Record Industry claims it is/was and they were losing money, that the prices would lower because of it. I guess they knew that they had the law on their side, so why bother, and just use that as an excuse when they sue! And all this, after they told us that they would indeed lower CD prices after the first few years, and more people had bought CD players. Though, the prices continued to rise and they still say that even today. Hypocrisy at work no doubt! No wonder why the government has talked about setting up stricter rules on pricing and whatnot. Some will say, it is their right to sell at whatever cost they deem necessary. Though, most of those costs are inflated the same way the military spend thousands of dollars on an single hammer. Pathetic really, isn't it!

All that said, with my regular spots like Amazon and CDNOW becoming rather poor in quality IMO. I have been thinking of just restarting to do retail shopping. I hear Intrada lets visitors come by on occasion, and buy in person. Maybe that would be the way to go, not living that far from where they are located?!

As for DVD', they aren't that bad. Though, I rarely will consider paying more than $25. Just be glad they are not too much more than VHS, is what I always say!

Oh well, that is all for now!

Regards,
Sean Robert Abbey