I think that the best Horner score is:

The Rocketeer!

-it has a great theme
-Jenny is beautiful, my all-time favorite romantic theme
-the Zeppelin cue ends in a wonderful loud climax- I love it!
-the end titles are thrilling, Horners best ever

plus the cd has superb poster art!

Included in this perfection is James Horner's score despite whether he ripped it off from IVAN THE TERRIBLE or some other thing. Would you have been happier had he scored the film by taking IVAN THE TERRIBLE and laying it directly under the video track? The point is not what he was influenced by. The point is that he was influenced. This is what artists do if you are one. All artists steal (if that's what you want to call it) whether you are a composer, writer, painter. One borrows ideas, thoughts and impressions from what we have already seen and heard whether it's someone else's work or our own past memories or the memory of another. This is called inspiration.

I suppose I get tired of the bashing of artists on this board. These composers have brought us here to this message board to share a passion. A passion that has been placed in us as it was placed in them (by another composer) to execute their own artistry as these composers help us execute ours in the form of writing, editing, painting or even composing music ourselves.

I'm glad Jimmy is influenced by other composers. It means he is an artist and recognizing those who've shaped his passion. What you have to ask yourself is this: Is what this composer did working with the visual media? If it is, what's the beef? Whether they take someone else's theme and place it under the visual (as many do like Michael Kamen with "Johnny Comes Marching Home" in DIE HARD 3 which no one complains about) or borrow from their own work. Who cares? Does it work with the movie. Now the visuals may not support the music. But you'll know this I believe.

There's too much time spent on arguing over non-important details like this. Let's share our passion for the subject, not our hate.

With Kamen, most of his "rip offs" are intended as "wink-wink in-jokes", which makes perfect sense.

As much as I enjoy Glory, Horner's rip off isn't the same. Unless, of course, Horner has an awful sense of humor ("Ivan The Terrible killed his own son, just like some people did in the Civil War! Hah! Get it? Get it?!? Hello?!?.......).

Twelve years ago I got yelled at by a soundtrack mafioso (not Ford Thaxton) for writing a review that observed that Horner was writing TOO MUCH music every year. "How can there be TOO MUCH?" he roared. I countered that Horner was basically pissing away his talent by doing any and all projects that came his way, and EVEN THEN was suffering from a kind of uniformity in his work. Although he's written some very good scores since that time, his basic laziness and kleptomania and apparent desire to see his name on as many posters as possible (until after TITANIC) seems to have ruled his judgement. I'd be fascinated to see his recent Charlie Rose interview where he claims he's not in it for the money ...

Maybe because I'm more of a mellow listener but the sound just wasn't great. It was good. But not great.

Maybe because I'm more of a mellow listener but the sound just wasn't great. It was good. But not great.

What?? Has he stated this in interviews? I have a hard time believing that composers are using their compositions as a forum to nudge the audience. How does that make sense? I think, as I said before, the composer looks at the film and decides what's best for the film. What best matches the visuals present. Sometimes they are allowed the luxury and freedom of creating the music on their own without being harnessed to the visuals. As long as it works.

However, you must understand that a composer is serving clients(the studio execs) and many of these clients have the creative intelligence of a roof shingle. The composer, just like editors(of which I am one) look at the budget, look at what they are given and work accordingly while all along being stifled by these clients. Sometimes, I assume they must throw up their hands and say "I'm just here to get the check. You all do it the way you want. I've tried to make this better to no avail." Of course, this is not verbally expressed unless they risk losing the job. But this accounts for the noise we hear. I have a hard time believing a composer, especially Horner with his reputation, sits back a says "For this movie I think I deliver a turd." And so, a composer will not be able to deliver THE MISSION or GONE WITH THE WIND every time. But if you want to compare track records, I think Horner's music has proven, with it's lush memorable themes, much more dynamic than Michael Kamen's, even with blockbusters like X-MEN. I walked out of that theatre not one theme remembered.

Kamen has in fact stated such things in interviews. Perhaps the in-jokes are between himself and musicians. Just like when Horner steals traditional African music for Bopha(!) and has a laugh about it at his local klan meeting.

Thanks for listenin' to my soapbox though...

Dan (UK)