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Author	Topic: A Concern about Footlight and some John Scott CDs

TimT Standard Userer	I just received 4 JOS CDs I orderd from Footlight, and 2 of them- King of the Wind and William the Conquer were not shrink wrapped, and had a few scuff marks on the outer CD cases or they looked almost like were used copies. The other 2 CDs- Shergar and Becoming Colette are still sealed. I know that Colette and Shergar are newer releases and William and King of the Wind are older ones. So my question is are the older releases supposed to be unshrink wrapped, or is Footlight selling used CDs and not mentioning it? This also happened before with CDnow, when I bought Willow, the CD was unsealed and un shrink wrapped. And even earlier with the Rock/Crimson Tide 2 CDset, both CDs had hole punches in the UPS bar. NP- William the Conquer (John Scott) [Message edited by TimT on 11-27-2000]
posted 11-27-2000 11:52 AM PT (US)

logied Standard Userer	One thing to watch with Footlight is when you order from the Composer list you maybe also ordering from a specials list at the same time. Some Scott title are OOP but maybe Store used. Give them a buzz and let them know your concern, they charge enough to give good service. An unwrapped CD from CDNOW or Footlight maybe a return and condition should be perfect if resold.
posted 11-27-2000 01:16 PM PT (US)

majestyx Standard Userer	Tim, Many European releases were/are not shrink-wrapped, especially German and UK releases, even though they are brand-new. I know that the new Twilight Zone and Under Fire are not wrapped. If you find copies that are, someone just used a shrink-wrap machine. It's pretty easy to tell the difference between a "factory-sealed" CD and one that the seller wrapped. The scuff marks MAY have been a result of careless shipping on the retailer's or the distributor's part, most likely the latter. Now discs with UPC hole-punches are either cut-outs or promo copies. Hopefully you got these at a discount. If not, then they shouldn't have been sold as "new" merchandise. [Message edited by majestyx on 11-27-2000]
posted 11-27-2000 01:18 PM PT (US)

TimT Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by majestyx: Tim, Now discs with UPC hole-punches are either cut-outs or promo copies. Hopefully you got these at a discount. If not, then they shouldn't have been sold as "new" merchandise. [Message edited by majestyx on 11-27-2000] Nope I paid full price for that set, about $26. As for the JOS CDs, they seemed ok no scracthes or anything, just a little dusty on the surface of the disc, I guess they've just been sitting around on Footlights shelves for a long time. However William the Conquer does have some a light crackling noise in the very last track, is anyone elses like that? NP- King of the Wind (John Scott)
posted 11-27-2000 01:44 PM PT (US)

Scorro Standard Userer	I had an experience with Footlight by which they sent me a CD in a plastic bag which was so 'notched' with a saw that the notch extended about 3/8" into the artwork on both sides. The CD was sold to me as new and no advance warning of this state of affairs was given. The disc itself was in mint condition. Because of the rarity and desirability of the CD, I kept it. I have rcv'd unwrapped CD's from this and other vendors of hard to get items, again with no advance warning. My point of view: All CD's sold by these vendors should be considered as 'new' with original shrinkwrap. Any changes to this should be communicated beforehand. I strongly suspect that all JOS CD's were originally shrinkwrapped, although the William CD I rcv'd (not from Footlight) did not have a wrapper. Again, I chose to keep the CD because I think it's fantastic! Regards, _Sc P.S. I have not noticed any problem w/ William's last track. I will check my CD and get back to you. [Message edited by Scorro on 11-27-2000] [Message edited by Scorro on 11-27-2000]
posted 11-27-2000 03:18 PM PT (US)

Brad Wills Standard Userer	Several of the earlier JOS releases, WTC among them, had disc flaws. Check your CD and see if it's turning an odd copper color. It's pretty noticeable. Anyway, the crackling noise sounds suspiciously like what happens with this acknowledged flaw and the problem will only get worse. Visit the John Scott website and there's a section that asks "Are your discs turning brown?" Click on this and it'll tell you all you need to know, including how to get a replacement. [Message edited by Brad Wills on 11-27-2000]
posted 11-27-2000 05:47 PM PT (US)

Scorro Standard Userer	I played William The Conqueror last evening and my copy has excellent fidelity. Brad is correct about replacements... I have 2 which have turned copper colored and they were replaced promptly (there is no distortion on those 2, but there could be on others). Good luck, _Sc
posted 11-28-2000 08:56 AM PT (US)

TimT Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by Scorro: I played William The Conqueror last evening and my copy has excellent fidelity. Brad is correct about replacements... I have 2 which have turned copper colored and they were replaced promptly (there is no distortion on those 2, but there could be on others). Good luck, _Sc Do you live in the UK? and Did you have to send the bronzed disc to them? And how long ago was this? thanks NP- Becoming Colette (John Scott)
posted 11-28-2000 09:03 AM PT (US)

Scorro Standard Userer	1) I live in the USA 2) No, I only sent them a letter of explanation as per their instructions (need to include manufacturing # on disc) 3) This occured within the last month or so. These guys really stand by their word, which only makes me more of a JOS fan. (In regards to supporting the label; I'd be a fan of Mr. Scott's music no matter what). Cheers, _Sc
posted 11-28-2000 09:52 AM PT (US)

sabbey Standard Userer	All of this, is why I only use Footlight, as a last resort. Since, they charge full retail price, and usually, don't notify the customer about being "less than" new. While, I was fortunate to get both Hard Rain and Dangerous Beauty from them, without much problem. It is a bit off-putting, to say the least. Especially, at the price we get charged. Regards, Sean Robert Abbey
posted 11-28-2000 10:50 AM PT (US)

Lou Goldberg Standard Userer	Why were their discs turning brown? And is this a possibilty that can happen to other CDs or just some pressing glitch at JOS?
posted 11-28-2000 10:43 PM PT (US)

BMikeJ Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by Lou Goldberg: Why were their discs turning brown? And is this a possibilty that can happen to other CDs or just some pressing glitch at JOS? If you go to Randy Levy's John Scott site, I think your question will be answered. It's my understanding that the pressing facility, PDO, had a high dust content in the air and the dust was getting trapped in the discs during the process, which caused the discs to slowly decay. And this bronzing is not restricted to JOS discs. I think some Silva discs and some Unicorn discs were also prone to bronzing.
posted 11-28-2000 10:48 PM PT (US)

joan hue Standard Userer	Tim, will you be posting evaluations or reviews of the 4 Scott CD's? I'd like to know how they sound. Thanks. NP Epic Scores of Miklos Rozsa
posted 11-28-2000 10:55 PM PT (US)

Brad Wills Standard Userer	Why, JOAN...you silly thing! Naturally they're all wonderful!!
posted 11-29-2000 06:55 AM PT (US)

TimT Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by joan hue: [b]Tim, will you be posting evaluations or reviews of the 4 Scott CD's? I'd like to know how they sound. Thanks. Yeah I eventually will write some reviews for those 4 new ones. But I've written other reviews to John Scott's scores, check them out! John Scott Reviews [Message edited by TimT on 11-29-2000]
posted 11-29-2000 07:15 AM PT (US)

TimT Standard Userer	<BLOCKQUOTE><font size=1 face=arial>quote:</font><HR size=1>Originally posted by Scorro: 1) I live in the USA 2) No, I only sent them a letter of explanation as per their instructions (need to include manufacturing # on disc) 3) This occured within the last month or so. These guys really stand by their word, which only makes me more of a JOS fan. (In regards to supporting the label; I'd be a fan of Mr. Scott's music no matter what). Cheers, _Sc<HR size=1></BLOCKQUOTE> I mailed them about my CDs, and heres the e-mail response I got back from them quote: Dear Timothy Thank you for your Letter You say you recently got the following CD's - I take it in the last few months If this is so I am sorry but you will have to take this up with the shop you bought your CD's from Thank you and regards Now I dought Footlight will do anything about this. [Message edited by TimT on 12-18-2000]
posted 12-18-2000 03:45 PM PT (US)

BMikeJ Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by TimT: <BLOCKQUOTE><font size=1 face=arial>quote:</font><HR size=1> I mailed them about my CDs, and heres the e-mail response I got back from them <BLOCKQUOTE><font size=1 face=arial>quote:</font><HR size=1>[b] Dear Timothy Thank you for your Letter You say you recently got the following CD's - I take it in the last few months If this is so I am sorry but you will have to take this up with the shop you bought your CD's from Thank you and regards <HR size=1></BLOCKQUOTE> Now I dought Footlight will do anything about this. [/B] I'm stunned... Maybe PDO only repressed enough to cover the initial pressings and no longer have any corrected ones to give out. Which means some people may have asked for replacement discs and didn't actually need them. In other words, they lied about owning them and got free CDs. If I were you, Tim, I'd call or e-mail Footlight and find out the name of the owner/manager. Then I'd write a letter explaining what happened and where things stand right now. If they're sensible, they'll take care of you. I would.
posted 12-18-2000 05:19 PM PT (US)

Scorro Standard Userer	Tim, When you contacted the company which deals with JOS music, were you asking them about CD's which had 'bronzed' or was it regarding the unshrinkwrapped/used condition of 2 of the CD's you rcv'd from FootLight? I would expect them to help you with the 'bronzing' issue... the other is a FootLight problem (although William should play fine unless there is a significant abrasion on the playing surface). _Sc, just returned from Central America and immediately played some John Scott music
posted 12-18-2000 05:52 PM PT (US)

Stephen Lister Standard Userer	Thanks to this thread, I e-mailed PDO about two weeks ago re. two "bronzed" JOS CDs I have - and I just received a postcard from them saying they will be sending me 2 replacement discs. So they clearly still have enough corrected ones to give out.
posted 12-18-2000 06:23 PM PT (US)

TimT Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by Scorro: Tim, When you contacted the company which deals with JOS music, were you asking them about CD's which had 'bronzed' or was it regarding the unshrinkwrapped/used condition of 2 of the CD's you rcv'd from FootLight? I would expect them to help you with the 'bronzing' issue... the other is a FootLight problem (although William should play fine unless there is a significant abrasion on the playing surface). _Sc, just returned from Central America and immediately played some John Scott music No I contacted them about the CD Bronzing issue! And If I understand them correctly, just becuase I bought some of them recently, means I'm not elgible for replacements.
posted 12-18-2000 07:40 PM PT (US)

TimT Standard Userer	Hm. Now they want me to mail my CDs to them first.
posted 12-20-2000 07:52 PM PT (US)

BMikeJ Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by TimT: Hm. Now they want me to mail my CDs to them first. That's a good thing, Tim. That means they're going to replace them. Small price to pay to get this done.
posted 12-21-2000 10:08 AM PT (US)

webjedi Standard Userer	This is a general information post, and not as quite related to the JOS CDs. Most CDs, especially if they come from sources that are under investigation from customs, or just seem to be dealing with a lot of certain merchandise either are opened, or for the fact of making contents easier to check by customs, are sent and sold unsealed. Most products from Germany and Italy come that way. Only a few UK items I've purchased have shown up in such a fashion. When I was shopping in Germany a few years back, the same held true for retail... items were being sold as new were both in "factory sealed" and opened condition. Usually the CDs will be in pristine condition, and if there are cracked cases on the outside, they're just as easy to replace. If you do get a scratched CD,a couple of things could have happened... one, it became dislodged from the internal prongs and slid around in the case...two, it was actually inspected by customs (usually if things are questionably or not declared on the outside)... or three... you got shafted with a used product... in either case, as a consumer, you can request a refund or other recourse by law...unless specified by a disclaimer on the site/store. I hope this helps... David
posted 12-21-2000 10:30 AM PT (US)

TimT Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by BMikeJ: <BLOCKQUOTE><font size=1 face=arial>quote:</font><HR size=1>Originally posted by TimT: [b]Hm. Now they want me to mail my CDs to them first.<HR size=1></BLOCKQUOTE> That's a good thing, Tim. That means they're going to replace them. Small price to pay to get this done.[/B] Yes. But why didn't Scorro have to send them CDs?
posted 12-21-2000 05:44 PM PT (US)

BMikeJ Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by TimT: <BLOCKQUOTE><font size=1 face=arial>quote:</font><HR size=1>Originally posted by BMikeJ: [b] <BLOCKQUOTE><font size=1 face=arial>quote:</font><HR size=1>Originally posted by TimT: [b]Hm. Now they want me to mail my CDs to them first.<HR size=1></BLOCKQUOTE> That's a good thing, Tim. That means they're going to replace them. Small price to pay to get this done.[/B]<HR size=1></BLOCKQUOTE> Yes. But why didn't Scorro have to send them CDs?[/B] Don't know what to tell you... I had to send my discs back. But a friend of mine who also wrote them did not.
posted 12-21-2000 07:34 PM PT (US)

TimT Standard Userer	Just an update on the CD Bronzing issue. It wasn't until last month did I actually decide to contact PDO and request replacement discs agian. Only this time I went all the way through with it, and mailed them mine out. Luckly all 3 CDs (Winter People, Williams the Conquer, and King of the Wind)were still in stock. The exchange took 3 weeks, but I now have my replacment discs!
posted 06-06-2006 12:13 AM PT (US)

Scorro Standard Userer	I'm impressed that after all these years they are still replacing bronzed discs. As for Footlight, they once sent me an unsealed copy of Mountains Of The Moon that someone had hacksawed 1/2 inch into the case and artwork (rather than drill a hole). I kept the CD as the music is that good.
posted 06-06-2006 10:41 AM PT (US)

JEC Standard Userer	My experience with Footlight has been that they will send you a 'display copy'(which means it has been opened but not played) when they only have one of an item. That's fine, if they would tell you that first. I have returned CDs before because they were not sealed copies. I only use Footlight as a last resort now. I have bought John Scott CDs from Screen Archives that were mint, but unsealed. The CD cases were scuffed, which annoys me almost as much as getting a defective CD or a CD with a broken tray. But that seems to be the risk when buying imports.
posted 06-06-2006 10:53 AM PT (US)

TimT Standard Userer	quote: Originally posted by Scorro: As for Footlight, they once sent me an unsealed copy of Mountains Of The Moon that someone had hacksawed 1/2 inch into the case and artwork (rather than drill a hole). I kept the CD as the music is that good. Thats exactly what happened to me when I bought Yor: Hunter from the Furture from them. The cut was not only about an 1/2 inch in it was also just as wide! And they didn't warn me about the condition of the discs either. However they were happy to take my $30.!
posted 06-06-2006 09:10 PM PT (US)

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