-
Message Boards

Movie Soundtracks
Do You Read Books Cinematically?
Archive of old forum. No more postings.
Please visit our new forum, The MovieMusic Lobby, to post new topics.
Author
Topic: Do You Read Books Cinematically?

Graham Watt

Oscar® Winner

Assuming we all occasionally read books, how do you read them? I'm afraid I tend to read them as if there was a film going on inside my head.This makes life difficult, because, as the dialogue scenes unfold in "real time", the stories last forever. And descriptive passages turn into lengthy voiceovers, so the whole shape of the novel is lost. Nevertheless, it all seems to me quite vivid, and the "music scores" develop as I read.
This can't be the best way to read, though, and literary people will be horrified. How do YOU read?
posted 07-22-2000 12:41 PM PT (US) 
Mark Olivarez

Oscar® Winner

Actually I do, minus a score though. I tend to play it out visually as I read. I may stop reading to set the scene in my mind. I would think most people would tend to read this way. I could be wrong. Or after reading a few chapters I might mentally revisit what I've just read and picture how it would be on a big screen.
posted 07-22-2000 01:41 PM PT (US) 
Shivered_McTimber

Oscar® Winner

Hey, I do as well...As a composer (Someday, I'll score a big film, just you wait and see), I like to think of music as I read. It's good practice, seeing as I have to do the same thing when I score the "Student Films" that I get scripts and tapes from.
And I don't see anything wrong with reading as such! It's the BEST way to read!
~Shivered~
NP: "Independence Day" by Arnold.posted 07-22-2000 01:54 PM PT (US) 
H Rocco
Oscar® Winner

Depending how much I like it, I may imagine certain actors in certain of the "roles," and if I'm especially caught up, I'll be thinking of music to go with it. If I REALLY like it, and figure I might have a shot at filming it myself one day (before someone else snaps it up), I'll write notes, modify dialogue (so many writers go overboard with this -- less really is more sometimes), and even draw storyboards in the margins. I've done that with several novels, and I will NOT tell you what they are, because so far no one else seems to be aware they exist, hence I can get to them first. (One of them WAS optioned for Hollywood on publication -- MANY years ago -- but nothing came of it -- I'm not too surprised, it's a hideously dark story and they probably didn't know quite what to do with it. Heh, I do. Come to think of it, one of them, a crime novel, was made into a movie in Europe, but from what I can glean of it, that version is much different from the one I'd do. Anyway, that movie never played here.)When I was much younger, I'd think of EVERY book I read in terms of a potential movie, but now I think I'll be better off making my own material, for the most part. Still, there are a few books I've read that present some irresistible challenges. It'd be nice to make a decent version of A TREE GROWS IN BROOKLYN -- the original Hollywood version is hopelessly bowdlerized and sentimentalized, and the 1973 TV version is even worse (just an hour and a quarter long, and so obviously a TV pilot that it's quite retch-worthy, despite a Goldsmith score, although I can't remember a note of it.)
NP: X-MEN
posted 07-22-2000 01:55 PM PT (US) 
JJH

Oscar® Winner

I certainly read Caleb Carr's The Alienist cinematically.I could just SEE Gary Oldman as Dr Kreiszler, in a Dracula sort of way.
and the music?
None other than JJ's own blend of Howard Shore's Se7en with a tad of Anton Webern thrown in.posted 07-22-2000 01:59 PM PT (US) 
John C Winfrey

Oscar® Winner

The vast majority of what I read these days is historical/factual or current events/politics/international stuff. Just straight-forward reading on those. On older books, historical and fiction, I did exactly as you folks describe, visualize pictures with the story. Best, john.
posted 07-22-2000 04:18 PM PT (US) 
Todd Reifinger
Oscar® Winner

Some writers write very cinematically, in terms of either dialogue or action. Elmore Leonard writes the most realistic, dead-on dialogue I've ever read. For example, watch Frankenheimer's film version of "52 Pick-Up," then read Leonard's book. A good deal of Frankenheimer's dialogue is lifted right from Leonard's prose--in fact, I believe Leonard wrote the actual screenplay.As for action, David Morrell has an extremely cinematic approach. "First Blood," "Testament," and "Last Reveille" are bursting with in-your-face, vividly rendered action scenes. In the introduction to the most recent printing of "Last Reveille," Morrell even discusses the importance of classic western films on the writing of that novel.
posted 07-22-2000 04:20 PM PT (US) 
Shaun Rutherford

Oscar® Winner

JJ,
The Alienist is a GREAT book! I'm glad somebody else I know read it. At the time of the book's publication, Philip Kaufman was to direct the adaptation, hot off the entrails of Rising Sun. Needless to say, I was more than a bit put off by that prospect. One of those times that I was GLAD a film was put into turnaround (still waiting for Garbage Pail Kids: The Movie II and White Afro Man, which at one time was to star Peter Frampton, but has now passed on to Ryan Phillippe; in time, I guess both will get made...).Shaun
posted 07-22-2000 07:27 PM PT (US) 
H Rocco
Oscar® Winner

Mr. Reifinger's comment about Elmore Leonard reminded me of why JACKIE BROWN is easily Quentin Tarantino's best movie to date ... he basically copied his script line-for-line and scene-for-scene from Leonard's novel "Rum Punch," actually adapting from the master rather than just kyping from him, as Tarantino usually does. (Although the picture is still too damn long. But Elmore's people are terser than Quentin's, and therefore easier to spend that amount of time with. One more babbling monologue about this or that piece of 1970s arcana ...)
posted 07-22-2000 08:05 PM PT (US) 
James

Oscar® Winner

I read in EXACTLY the same manner as H Rocco described, right down to considering books for future film projects. (I hope we never end up competing for one.
) For the same reason, I can't tell you what books I have in mind, with the exception of the Harry Potter series, which has already been picked up by Chris Columbus... which disturbs me beyond words.Then again, a really, really great book is one which I will enjoy immensely but at the same time not be able to visualize cinematically... that makes it a true piece of WRITING. That's one of the things that makes Lewis Carroll so attractive to me, and also the reason that a good version of Alice in Wonderland has never been made. It seems impossible to adapt (and I would never even CONSIDER attempting it).
James
NP - Jenkins, String Quartet No. 2posted 07-22-2000 09:41 PM PT (US) 
James

Oscar® Winner

Just a quick follow-up to my comment concerning Alice... regardless of the quality of the recent TV production itself, I loved Richard Hartley's score, Gene Wilder's performance as Mock Turtle, and I absolutely adore Tina Majorino.
posted 07-22-2000 09:46 PM PT (US) 
H Rocco
Oscar® Winner

mmm, I wouldn't worry too much about us competing for the same projects, Captain ... I'm more worried just about getting to do as much as I want to do. At least if YOU got hold of (fill in the blank), I'd feel we had a good shot at a good movie ... you're unproven -- but so am I! -- and having met you, I'd hire you in a second over Joel Schumacher or Michael Bay. (no, I haven't met THEM, but who needs to? I know what those two are about. Their atrocities are splattered all over the video shelves.)I haven't yet read the Harry Potter books (although Stephen King just wrote a rave in the NYTimes Book Review for the latest one, and for the series as a whole), and probably wouldn't want a crack at them myself -- but then again, were I so lucky, I would accept the assignment just to rescue them from Chris Columbus. Ugh, ugh, ugh, and to think that the author fell out with Spielberg because he wanted to cast Haley Joel Osment as Harry. At least Osment is an excellent actor! Now Columbus has contravened the author's wishes and cast one of the brats from MRS. DOUBTFIRE (or was it STEPMOM?) in the role of Harry, insisting that there were no British child actors suitable for the role. (The original casting director quit because of this. It was widely reported. Way back at the time of GREMLINS, Spielberg said of Columbus, "You could drop a stone into the well of Chris's imagination and never hear it hit bottom." I think it's more accurate to say that you never hear anything hit bottom in a vacuum.)
Tim Roth is supposed to be up for the villain's role in "Harry Potter," but it would conflict with playing Zaius (or someone like Zaius) in PLANET OF THE APES, which he's also up for. He hasn't picked which one he prefers yet. If APES is starting as soon as I think it is, he might be able to do both ... well, this is not my problem. I find this more interesting: if Roth is playing Zaius or, at least, a tormenting ape of some kind, that suggests that the story is being completely rethought -- which I say is a good thing (I do NOT want a pro forma remake of APES, and I'm glad Tim Burton is directing, since it suggests we're going to get something very different from the original.)
I've fantasized for years about filming Stephen R. Donaldson's "Chronicles of Thomas Covenant" (a pair of trilogies), although I now recognize that what makes the books special won't really translate to film -- at least, I can't figure out how. It would have to be a miniseries at the very least, and a gigantic one at that. These days, the more difficult effects COULD be done, even for television, but what I'd had in mind was an animated epic, with Michael Caine doing the voice of Covenant (in fact I made very specific notes about who should do which voice), but now I'm not sure such a project should be done, either animated or live. Donaldson's work is extremely internal, and I'm not sure one could be true to his writing AND make a satisfying production, in the same breath. Some books should just stay books. (So what do I do with the music I thought up to go with some of the lyrics Donaldson included? Well, none of it is necessarily THAT great, but I can't see it fitting in anything else I want to do ...)
NP: TORA TORA TORA (FSM version) (I am planning a Japanese-related WW2 movie that will blow PEARL HARBOR out of the water, and I don't care HOW much it costs or how big it looks. I used to want to adapt FROM HERE TO ETERNITY as well -- another one that was hopelessly betrayed by its old-Hollywood adaptation, and not improved a whit by its TV miniseries reincarnation -- but the excellent 1998 film of its quasi-sequel THE THIN RED LINE has kind of dampened my enthusiasm. It would still be fun to do that final scene on the boat, however, and a couple of other bits. But on balance, it's really too long a book to do it proper justice. I'll stick to my original story, and that will be my single contribution to WW2 cinema. With any luck.)
posted 07-22-2000 11:37 PM PT (US) 
Dawk

Oscar® Winner

And here I was thinking I was the only one that did that. Oh well, anyone who wants to have a really weird flick developing inside thier head should check out Clive Barker's Imajica. The music I've invisioned for that one is a combination of Waterworld and The Devil's Advocate. So it goes without saying that if I were to ever make it into a film, I'd work like hell to get JNH to score it.
Dawk
posted 07-23-2000 10:03 AM PT (US) 
Timmer

Oscar® Winner

Dawk, have you read Barker's Weaveworld, my favorite book of his, I always felt Clive Barker's books worked better when they were set in a more British/European element (such as Damnation Game) than when he steps into stephen King territory, i.e. American culture.
Graham, I rarely listen to scores while reading, the times I have, is usually to get something out of my head, for example, I can't get 'Raiders of the Lost Ark' off my mind while reading something really innapropriate to that music, so I'll put on something like Snow Falling on Cedars by JNH to exorcise the offending melody, or at least something without such a strongly linked vision....I mean, could anyone here read John Steinbeck with the James Bond theme running around your skull??!
NP : Dogma - Shore
posted 07-23-2000 06:00 PM PT (US) 
JJH

Oscar® Winner

no, but I could with a certain classic Elmer Bernstein score...
posted 07-23-2000 06:23 PM PT (US) 
MWRuger

Oscar® Winner

HRocco, if you need any help with research materials on your WWII pacific conflict pic, let me know. I have oodles of stuff.I love to read, but I don't read cinematically. I just let it all happen.
NP: Lost in Space expanded
posted 07-23-2000 09:58 PM PT (US) 
James

Oscar® Winner

Timmer -Sure I can. All the farm hands are sitting around a table in suits, drinking martinis and complaining (in British accents) about the smell of Candy's dog.
posted 07-23-2000 11:07 PM PT (US) 
H Rocco
Oscar® Winner

Thank you Mr. Ruger, I'll keep that in mind. I've found damn little about the subject I was hoping to film as it is, and actually take that as a good sign -- territory ripe for expansion, one might say. (I've told the basic story to Japanese filmmakers who happened to be alive during that time, and they thought I was on to something, which is even more promising ... I'd better get cracking before more of them have gone from us.)
posted 07-23-2000 11:47 PM PT (US) 
Graham Watt

Oscar® Winner

Timmer, I never listen to music whilst reading either: I meant that my mind conjures up the appropriate soundscapes to "score" what I'm reading at the time.Sometimes my books are way overscored!
posted 07-24-2000 09:11 AM PT (US) 
Timmer

Oscar® Winner

Ahhh a misunderstanding!, in that case I agree with you 100% Graham.....especially on the over-scored point
NP : Rob Roy - Burwell
posted 07-24-2000 04:54 PM PT (US) 
Timmer

Oscar® Winner

Speaking of books, I'm half way through Thomas Harris's HANNIBAL. The point being that I read Red Dragon and Silence of The Lambs before their respective films, so I had my own ideas as to what the characters looked like, with Hannibal its really hard trying to get away from the images of Hopkins, Foster and even Scott Glen as Crawford. anyone else here have problems getting away from a strongly identified actor/actress from a filmed novel?!
posted 07-24-2000 05:48 PM PT (US) 
Todd Reifinger
Oscar® Winner

Again, allow me to mention David Morrell's "First Blood." The main characters are much different from the film version, but it's very difficult not to picture Sly Stallone and Brian Dennehy in your mind, even though Rambo is described as looking like a full-bearded hippie.[This message has been edited by Todd Reifinger (edited 24 July 2000).]
posted 07-24-2000 08:14 PM PT (US) 
JoeInSanDiego

Oscar® Winner

Hannibal was almost impossible for me to read because the actors inhabited the characters so perfectly in my head...another reason why, I think, the end of the book was just a little too surreal for me to deal with.First Blood holds a special place in my heart as a film. I was amazed at what a HORRIBLE job the film version did at adapting the novel, although I enjoyed the movie. Morrell is one of those authors could write an intense shopping list. I'll read anything he puts out simply on faith. My favortie of his, to this day, is THE LEAGUE OF NIGHT AND FOG and don't think I'd love to adapt THAT one into a film...wow...
NP - YIJ I (McNeely - Paris 1916)
posted 07-25-2000 10:12 AM PT (US) 
Todd Reifinger
Oscar® Winner

Joe, glad to know that someone on this board has actually read "First Blood." Is it still out of print? I bought my copy at a used bookstore for $1.50 and it's got the movie tie-in cover. Do you have an earlier edition with a different cover? I'm curious as to what it would look like.As for Morrell novels being made into films, I'd have to vote for "Testament" and "The Totem" (the most recent edition, with all the missing material).
posted 07-25-2000 05:21 PM PT (US) 
joan hue

Oscar® Winner

Hi Todd. I read FIRST BLOOD when it was first published. Loved it.
It had just a plain red cover with the title. No Sly graced the front. H’ness
put me on to TESTAMENT, which I had somehow missed. Great book
that would make a tense, action packed movie. Also liked TOTEM.In the past decade, however, Morrell’s books, for me at least,
have disintegrated into cliché ridden espionage novels. I read his latest,
BURNT SIENNA, last week and “yawned” my way through it. Wish
he’d go back to his rather novel action roots. I also love THE RED
DRAGON and SILENCE OF THE LAMBS. I was horribly disappointed
with HANNIBAL and could well understand Jodie Foster’s exit from a
remake.NP The Untouchables
posted 07-25-2000 07:03 PM PT (US) Old Infopop Software by UBB
