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      Kamen is back with a vengeance

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    Author
    Topic:   Kamen is back with a vengeance

     Steve Hughes
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     Oscar® Winner
     

    I know, I know I keep banging on about Michael Kamen and his score to X-MEN, but I just read Soundtrackmag.com's review and listened to a few more audio samples and I have to say I am (if it's possible) even more even more excited about the score!!!!

    Two of the tracks, The X-Jet and Final Showdown made the hairs on the back of my neck stand up, honest to god.

    Kamen has long been my favourite composer but his output over the last few years has been disappointing but with this score, he will be back. BIG TIME. It's back to his muscular old style sound, with a few modern electronics in places that I haven't heard from him before... and I like it.

    I'm already giving this score 10 out of 10 -- I can't wait until it comes out, which supposedly is on the 11th July...

    Check it out for yourselves:
    http://www.soundtrackmag.com/

    It's under their CD Reviews section.

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    posted 07-07-2000 11:29 AM PT (US)     

     dantoris
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    Here's what I said earlier on the subject, and I stand by it even more fully now after hearing those samples:

    --------------------
    Too bad Elfman didn't score it. While I'm certainly no Kamen-hater, it would appear as though he has composed yet another dud (though Amazon always chooses the worst portions of tracks for their samples). "Mutant School" sounds like it should be in an animated Disney movie.

    Guess I'll know for sure when I see the movie, and the only reason I'm doing so is to see the film self-implode from it's overblownness on the big screen.

    . . . that, and to see Famke Janseen in that leather outfit.
    --------------------

    Ever since Robin Hood: Prince of Thieves, Kamen's music has left me unimpressed, and this score sounds like it will continue the trend.

    A shame, too, because I was really hoping that whenever the X-Men movie finally got made it would be really good, but it just looks like a total disaster.

    I still crack up everything I think about the person in the theater who, when the trailer for the film was over, shouted out, "Get me some Advil!!"

    NP: Sounds Exciting - "Narrow Margin: Choppers and Rails" *****/***** (Perhaps Broughton should have scored X-Men? This CD has some of the best, hard-charging action music I've ever heard!)

    [This message has been edited by dantoris (edited 07 July 2000).]

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    posted 07-07-2000 11:54 AM PT (US)     

     JJH
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    composed another dude?
    or did you mean dud?

    sorry. it was so funny

    NP -- The Challenge. Next: Bring on Under Fire!!!!!!!!

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    posted 07-07-2000 01:22 PM PT (US)     

     dantoris
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    Oops. Was typing in a hurry and didn't have time to spellcheck.

    NP: Mission: Impossible rejected - "The Vault/Langley" ****/***** (A great action that went unused . . . though there's absolutely nothing wrong with the score that replaced it.)

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    posted 07-07-2000 01:35 PM PT (US)     

     pietari
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    Sorry Steve, but have to agree with Dandoris here. Sounds like another disapointment here from Kamen.
    The music sounds like it came from some 80´s B-film, there´s nothing "superhero-ish" aboutthe music at all and it seems that Kamen has gone The Iron Giant way again- no central unifying theme that a film like this really needs
    But then again the full score may turn out better, at least I hope so

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    posted 07-07-2000 02:33 PM PT (US)     

     PeterK
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     FishChip
     

    I must jump in here and defend Kamen's score for Iron Giant. The reason there is not ONE unifying theme in the score is because there are TWO themes (one for each leading character) that beautifully bond as these two characters share very emotionally bonding experiences in the film.

    Personally, Kamen's score for Iron Giant was a much smarter score than anything written last summer. Perhaps people wrote it off because they've been SO NUMBED by the boring, thoughtless, factory-generated sound-a-like scores from the last 5-10 years?

    Not to say everything written in the last 5-10 years was bad, but there are quite a few clones out there. Disagree?

    PeterK

    NP - "Stir of Echoes" by JN Howard

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    posted 07-07-2000 03:51 PM PT (US)     

     Jeron
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    I listened to the clips at Soundtrackmag.com, and it does sound like it's going to be a very, very good score. I've been waiting for an X-Men movie forever, too Dantoris. I was a die-hard collector when I was younger, and X-Men were my favorite in the world of comic books.

    Bryan Singer is an excellent director, and I think his approach suits X-Men incredibly well. It's different than I thought it should be, but hey - it's his film, and Singer has never disappointed me before. Kamen has never disappointed me, and from the clips (video and sound) that I've been exposed to, well... I just don't think I'll be disappointed. In all actuality, I can't wait.

    Saying that so-and-so and this-and-that are going to make the film a total disaster isn't fair. In fact, you are obviously unhappy with that conclusion - and to second guess a film before you've seen it in it's entirety sounds like the perfect formula for misery. I tend to take a positive approach on everything. Why? Because I enjoy being happy. I guess that's why I enjoy so many things... I'm rarely disappointed.

    Just something to think about.

    Jeron

    NP - The Fugitive (JNH) *****/*****

    [This message has been edited by Jeron (edited 07 July 2000).]

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    posted 07-07-2000 04:22 PM PT (US)     

     André Lux
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    Altough I can't say I'm a huge fan of Kamen's bombastic action scores I must admit he sounds like a good idea for "X-MEN".

    Anyway, he's much better than Danny Elfman and is hundreds of years ahead of any of the Music Vaporizers... Just listen to "BRAZIL" or "BARON MUNCHAUSEN" if you're not following me.

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    posted 07-07-2000 05:36 PM PT (US)     

     dantoris
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    Jeron - I don't believe I said Michael Kamen himself was going to ruin the entire film. I was just saying his score (again) doesn't sound to impressive. Then again, perhaps it's just the 30 seconds samples I've been hearing. (They always tend to pick the worst parts of tracks to do the samples of).

    My biggest problem is with the casting. Other than Patrick Stewart and Famke Janseen, everyone else looks out of place. I mean Ian McKellen as Magneto? A fine actor, but come on! He looks about as intimidating in that costume as a priest on Sunday. Sean Connery would've been the perfect choice for the role. (Though after the debacle of The Avengers, I doubt he would do it).

    It just looks like a movie that is gonna try to be too much and fail in the process.

    Like I said, I'm still seeing the movie (just for Stewart and Janseen), so we'll see where I stand afterwards. But from the looks of things I've been seeing, and hearing, so far, it doesn't look to good.

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    posted 07-07-2000 05:49 PM PT (US)     

     Hard Target
     Oscar® Winner
     

    I completely agree with Peter K. The Iron Giant was one of the best scores I heard last year. Remind me to put that on tonight. It's a fun, over the top score one of the best in animation with the likes of Goldsmith's Secret of N.I.M.H., and Mulan. The Varese cd is definetly worth getting, I got it the day it was released and I haven't regretted it. And I'm really looking forward to his score for The X-Men which looks like a thrill ride in itself.

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    posted 07-07-2000 06:17 PM PT (US)     

     Al
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    I also will speak my mind about The Iron Giant. It's simply the best animated film I've ever seen(Chicken Run was claymation). As for the score... wow... there are moments that work more emotions with a few simple motifs than some modern composers have done with long, full-blown themes. The small motifs and their individual sounds remind me of the classical piece for "Peter and the Wolf."

    Really, The Iron Giant score was a brilliant piece of work. Listening to the whole score and following the developing motifs is like listening to an involving fable.

    NP: Safan's "The Last Starfighter"

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    posted 07-07-2000 07:37 PM PT (US)     

     TimT
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    The clips for X-Men sucked. Sorry.

    Iron Giant was alright though.

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    posted 07-07-2000 07:56 PM PT (US)     

     S Smith
    unregistered  

    Watch out for Storm. She'll hit you with her car and then take off.

    NP: Jerry Goldsmith: "Planet of the Apes."

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    posted 07-07-2000 08:45 PM PT (US)     

     Al
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    I believe X-Men is in good hands with Kamen. Sure, he doesn't use a huge main theme that encompasses the mood of the whole film, but he will have little themes for individual scenes that form a coherent musical story. His music can be a breath of fresh air after listening to the same old run-of-the-mill (run-of-the-mediaventures?) scores where a big theme with simple orchestration is spoon-fed to you over and over.

    "Look here, it's a Hans Zimmer rip-off theme. Yum. You'll like this. Open up wide. Yumm. Now have some more. And some more. And some more."


    NP: Shore's "Crash"

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    posted 07-07-2000 08:58 PM PT (US)     

     Observer
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    Doesn't look to good for Kamen so far, Harry Knowles rails on Kamen in his advance review:

    "The only gripes that anyone can legitimately make, in my opinion, is that Michael Kamen’s score is white noise. Meaning Kamen has yet again completely FAILED the film he was brought on to. Last time out was with THE IRON GIANT, who’s only flaw for me was the score... which wasn’t awful... it just isn’t great. Again here... Kamen turns in a non-offensively bland gathering of instruments playing a seemingly tone deaf hum in the background. And with a great score.... Had they had John Ottman or Jerry Goldsmith or Basil Poledouris or James Horner or SHIRLEY WALKER or Danny Elfman or John Williams... well... my really really really liking the movie, would have turned into absolute love."

    SOURCE: http://aint-it-cool-news.com/display.cgi?id=6386



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    posted 07-07-2000 09:28 PM PT (US)     

     TimT
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    quote:
    Originally posted by Al:
    [B]His music can be a breath of fresh air after listening to the same old run-of-the-mill (run-of-the-mediaventures?) scores where a big theme with simple orchestration is spoon-fed to you over and over.

    "Look here, it's a Hans Zimmer rip-off theme. Yum. You'll like this. Open up wide. Yumm. Now have some more. And some more. And some more."[B]


    You have to keep mind that many people like the sound of Media Venture action scores.
    What is a Hans Zimmer rip-off theme?

    NP- Apt Pupil (John Ottman)

    [This message has been edited by TimT (edited 07 July 2000).]

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    posted 07-07-2000 09:50 PM PT (US)     

     Al
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    TimT,

    You also have to consider that many people have no musical taste whatsoever, and it seems that a Hans Zimmer rip-off theme is anything composed at Mediaventures by anyone except Hans Zimmer. This isn't true for someone like Marc Mancina though, who left and developed his own voice.


    NP: Kamen's "Event Horizon"

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    posted 07-08-2000 10:13 AM PT (US)     

     TimT
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    Hmm I'm not sure how I should interpret that.
    Are you saying you have no musical taste or I have no musical taste?

    And another thing, I think all of the Media Venture guys have there own distinctive sound and ideas for themes....Even Trevor Rabin even though he's a MV wanna-be he still has his own sound.
    And by that I mean when I hear thier music, I can almost always ID the composer right away.

    [This message has been edited by TimT (edited 08 July 2000).]

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    posted 07-08-2000 10:40 AM PT (US)     

     Al
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    I'm saying that most of the population of movie-goers has no musical taste when it comes to film music. This way, it can be easy for any compositionally-impaired person to jump into the film scoring scene, write a simple theme on synth, let an orchestrator throw in an orchestra, and get some cash. BUT film score enthusiasts are not "most of the population."


    NP: Goldsmith's "Patton"


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    posted 07-08-2000 12:09 PM PT (US)     

     Mark Olivarez
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    quote:
    Originally posted by Observer:
    Doesn't look to good for Kamen so far, Harry Knowles rails on Kamen in his advance review:

    "The only gripes that anyone can legitimately make, in my opinion, is that Michael Kamen’s score is white noise. Meaning Kamen has yet again completely FAILED the film he was brought on to. Last time out was with THE IRON GIANT, who’s only flaw for me was the score... which wasn’t awful... it just isn’t great. Again here... Kamen turns in a non-offensively bland gathering of instruments playing a seemingly tone deaf hum in the background. And with a great score.... Had they had John Ottman or Jerry Goldsmith or Basil Poledouris or James Horner or SHIRLEY WALKER or Danny Elfman or John Williams... well... my really really really liking the movie, would have turned into absolute love."

    SOURCE: http://aint-it-cool-news.com/display.cgi?id=6386


    Yeah, there's someone who's opinions you can really trust. Oh boy....Anything Harry says I usually take as the exact opposite. I actually found the Iron Giant to be one of the more refreshing scores from last year. Based on some of the crappy animated movies Disney and others have been releasing, this one was overlooked and not really appreciated by many.

    [This message has been edited by Mark Olivarez (edited 08 July 2000).]

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    posted 07-08-2000 12:35 PM PT (US)     

     pietari
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    I think Knowles was talking about the score to Iron Giant, not the film, which he absolutely loved. I agree with you that Iron Giant is a brilliant film but the score wasn´t up to the standards IMHO

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    posted 07-08-2000 12:52 PM PT (US)     

     Will
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    I'm not quite impressed with the sample tracks offered by Soundtrackmag. But I am still giving this score a chance to prove itself when I watch the movie.

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    posted 07-09-2000 08:53 AM PT (US)     

     Scott
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    Gotta give my two cents...

    OH MAN!

    Sorry, gotta hear the whole score first!

    Gimme my two cents back!

    Hello!?
    Scott

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    posted 07-09-2000 11:14 AM PT (US)     

     Hard Target
     Oscar® Winner
     

    I agree with Mr.Scott, that is the biggest load of crap I've ever heard P. The score is awesome and so is The X-Men, which I happily found an advanced copy of yesterday in a used bin here in the city. It's a good 40 minutes (because it was recorded in L.A.), but this one will definetly be booted. lol I hate to say it but's true. So far now I'll be standing in line on Friday and check the flick out. There's my 5 cents.

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    posted 07-09-2000 11:42 AM PT (US)     

     HAL 2000
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    The clips were no great shakes. I'll see the movie and then decide "whether or not to blow your ship from the vater" oops, I mean, to buy the CD.

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    posted 07-10-2000 07:55 AM PT (US)     
     

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