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Author	Topic: Jesus by Patrick Williams

Kris Oscar® Winner	I just bought Patrick Williams' score to the epic mini series Jesus. Great score. It somehow reminds me of Danny Elfman's score Sommersby. Does anybody else have this score? For all who don't, I can really recommend it. It runs slightly over 50 minutes. It's played by a big orchestra. np Jesus ***/***
posted 05-19-2000 10:43 AM PT (US)

JJH Oscar® Winner	I bought this one the good word of mouth, and was slightly disappointed by it on my first and only listening. I obviously need to go back and listen again to find what it is others' hear in this work. NP -- Spiegel im Spiegel, Arvo Pärt
posted 05-19-2000 10:49 AM PT (US)

Al Oscar® Winner	JJH, This score didn't do much for me either. There were two moments in the score that stood out (one was used during the finale of the movie but appears earlier in the album), but they were too brief. To me, it sounded uninspired, and for such a religious score to sound uninspired is truly a shame. The only moving piece to me was the piece from Andrew Lloyd Webber's Requiem. It's a beautiful piece, and it shows the listener how much of a better tunesmith Webber is. There really is nothing in the score you can't hear elsewhere. I traded it. Too bad too. I had hoped for much better. NP: Elfman's "Sleepy Hollow"
posted 05-19-2000 11:49 AM PT (US)

Howard L Oscar® Winner	It certainly didn't do much for part 1 of the film for the reasons Al has mentioned. I'll watch part 2 on tape & see if it changes my assessment. These types of films are the best chance a composer has to having a field day and if it's not taken advantage of, I fear it may never be.
posted 05-19-2000 12:22 PM PT (US)

TimT Oscar® Winner	I also was dissopointed. For a film about Jesus, it's really lame. Theres no magic, no spark. I know the composer wanted to avoid the overly clichéd choir, in order to be more orginal, but I think that was a terrible decision. The music is never emotional, and the themes are unremarkable. especially Jesus' theme! This movie should have been temped track with something like Prince of Eygpt. NP- Dante's Peak (complete) (J. Frizzell & James N. Howard)
posted 05-19-2000 12:31 PM PT (US)

JJH Oscar® Winner	or John Williams' Grail theme!
posted 05-19-2000 03:28 PM PT (US)

Jeron Oscar® Winner	From what I saw, the second part benefitted greatly from the score. The crucifixion was especially moving, and while the overall score may be "lame," as Tim has called it... the story was told well. I'm not sure this one will be a big boost for Patrick Williams' career... but it gave him the opportunity to at least do something. It certainly didn't hurt the film. Oh, and Tim? I know you are biased towards Zimmer... and I love his music - but I think temping "Jesus" with something like Prince of Egypt would have been a bad idea. I believe there is a difference between "Old Testament" sound and "New Testament" sound. Old Testament music typically evokes a sense of wonder and unknowing. The stories of Noah's Ark, Jonah and the Whale, and even the Ten Commandments are quite wonderous. When you get into New Testament material, the knowledge of what all of those things meant becomes clearer. While they did have a purpose, it certainly begins to make more sense (in the bigger picture)... all in part due to Jesus and His teachings. Jesus did afterall give the world a clearer understanding of their God and what it means to be a Christian. I'm not trying to give a lecture. Nope, that's not my intention. I'm simply trying to shed a little bit of light on Patrick's approach to this film. The score may not have evoked a sense of wonder or glory as some of you may have hoped... but it was intelligent and moving at just the right moments. I think that's good enough justification. Yours truly, Jeronimo! [This message has been edited by Jeron (edited 19 May 2000).]
posted 05-19-2000 08:27 PM PT (US)

TimT Oscar® Winner	...and it didn't do too well on CD. When I mentioned POE i was specifically talking about The Burning Bush music. I thought that awsome music to portray God. Jesus needed something like that. I didn't mention it just becuase it was Hans Zimmer. Sunshine (Maurice Jarre) ?/5
posted 05-19-2000 09:29 PM PT (US)

Jeron Oscar® Winner	...and when I was talking about POE, the "Burning Bush" cue was exactly what I was referring to. That is a very wonderous piece of music... and of course, very "Old Testament" in its portrayal. ...and the score's representation on cd may very well be a bad one. I haven't heard it outside of the film. Regardless... my comments still stand. :-) Jer-Bear [This message has been edited by Jeron (edited 19 May 2000).]
posted 05-19-2000 10:25 PM PT (US)

Al Oscar® Winner	I understand how the film was meant to tell the story from the view of Jesus as a human. So the desired score was to be more earthly and human. But many, many film composers have given a regular human a musical theme that was much more moving than the one that Williams wrote for Jesus. His approach was right for the film, I believe. Unfortunately, it's done blandly, and the emotions that should have been there were not. NP: Goldsmith's "The Russia House"
posted 05-19-2000 10:28 PM PT (US)

Chris Kinsinger Oscar® Winner	Jesus was produced with severe budget restrictions, and it shows! Terrible cinematography, shabby costumes, spare sets...all of the physical markings of an enormous idea commited to film on a shoestring budget. I'm not faulting anyone here...I'm simply noting my observations. Why should the music be any more elaborate? Williams was probably working on a shoestring budget himself!
posted 05-19-2000 10:50 PM PT (US)

Al Oscar® Winner	How would budget limitations affect Williams's writing? Emotional music can be composed for simply a few woodwinds. Why, I am sure some well-written synth music could be more emotional. I am listening to the electronic The Seventh Sign and it did the trick in the film (even though orchestra would have done it even better). William's writing for Jesus was without much flavor at all. It's like chicken. It tastes like almost everything else.
posted 05-20-2000 09:49 AM PT (US)

Jeron Oscar® Winner	I thought chicken tastes like chicken... and then stuff like frog legs, etc. taste like chicken, too. But chicken doesn't taste like turkey... or pineapple... or mashed potatoes. Sorry... I couldn't resist. ;-) Back to Film Music! Jeron
posted 05-20-2000 10:09 AM PT (US)

Howard L Oscar® Winner	Well, having now seen Part 2 my assessment's a little different. Again, I'm with Al in that all the excuses in the world don't exonerate anyone from creating mediocre music, yet it must be difficult to create a score that breathes when a film doesn't breathe. This is where I have a major disagreement with Jeron. Part 2 seemed like it may have had an entirely different writer and director. The thing was filmed via the Bruckheimer method: nothing but snapshots in a let's-move-this-baby-right-along manner. Terrible. There's no question that to do it right an extended Roots-like miniseries is in order, and the possibilities, then, of a major score are obvious. Perhaps this whole thing could be summed in the old but true cliche that if you're going to do it, do it right or don't do it at all.
posted 05-20-2000 02:54 PM PT (US)

Jeron Oscar® Winner	Howard... I don't think we are in disagreement. I just didn't state my opinion about the second part. The music I think was effective... now how it was told? I wasn't that impressed. I was moved by the crucifixion scene, though (like I said above). Other than that, I agree w/ your comments! Jeron
posted 05-20-2000 05:42 PM PT (US)

Al Oscar® Winner	Hmm. According to the Chicken Theorem, if frog legs, etc. tasted like chicken, then wouldn't chicken also taste like frog legs, etc.? Some food for thought... Howard L, the old but true cliche in the 'biz is "do it right, or simply don't spend much moolah on the movie at all yet still make it, or, if it's the blockbuster season, spend all of your money on makeup for John Travolta and visual effects for a film even though the script and idea is a complete disaster." A run-on sentence, I know. That cliche was written by the screenwriter of Battlefield: Earth.
posted 05-21-2000 11:12 AM PT (US)

Kris Oscar® Winner	I've played Jesus something like 10 times now. I guess it's time to change my rating. np Jesus **/*** I tend to over- or underrrate scores the first couple of days after buying them.
posted 05-22-2000 02:20 AM PT (US)

Thor Oscar® Winner	>>I've played Jesus something like 10 times now. I guess it's time to change my rating.<< Indeed it is, Kris. What do your parents say when you put that "thorn ring" around your head?
posted 05-22-2000 06:10 AM PT (US)

Scott Oscar® Winner	Jeron, what in the world have you been eating? Glad to have your funny self back. You just cracked me up! After my weekend I needed that. Thanks. As far as the score to Jesus is concerned: It has its moments. I like the trumpet parts (then again, I'm a sucker for trumpets I guess). Haven't seen all of the series yet (my little nephew wants to watch it with me). Yet the part with the temptation in the desert I did see and thought it was awesome. Finally someones tried to portray Satan as he is. Not some ugly cross between a bull and horse, but a sometimes beautiful appearing entitiy who will steal, kill, destroy, lie, cheat and make false promises. Yep, that's Satan all right. Well, off to work I go... NP racula (John Williams) Now there is a score.
posted 05-22-2000 06:54 AM PT (US)

Al Oscar® Winner	I thought the portrayal of Satan was a bit dumb. I can ignore those contemporary clothes he was wearing, but if the devil looked and acted that evil when he actually visited Jesus, I can see how Jesus wasn't tempted for one fraction of a second! NP: Beltrami's "Crow: Salvation"
posted 05-22-2000 09:04 AM PT (US)

Chris Kinsinger Oscar® Winner	The writers of this show did not understand what was happening when Jesus was praying in the Garden. They showed Satan tempting Him NOT to be crucified. Satan was pleading with Him NOT to die on the cross. D'OH! Satan was the ONE who WANTED HIM DEAD! The Scriptures are SO CLEAR ON THAT ONE POINT! Satan only knew that this was God in the flesh, and so he tried many, many times to KILL HIM! And he finally succeeded! But if Satan had KNOWN what Jesus would accomplish...shedding his blood and dying on the cross...SINLESS...he NEVER would have wanted Jesus to make this ultimate sacrifice for all of mankind. The writers of this pathetic mini-series had no idea what they were doing. Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do.
posted 05-22-2000 10:02 PM PT (US)

Scott Oscar® Winner	quote: Originally posted by Chris Kinsinger: The writers of this show did not understand what was happening when Jesus was praying in the Garden. Satan was the ONE who WANTED HIM DEAD! The Scriptures are SO CLEAR ON THAT ONE POINT! Satan only knew that this was God in the flesh, and so he tried many, many times to KILL HIM! But if Satan had KNOWN what Jesus would accomplish...shedding his blood and dying on the cross...SINLESS...he NEVER would have wanted Jesus to make this ultimate sacrifice for all of mankind. [/B] Chris, I disagree with you on certain points. Yes, Satan wanted Jesus dead, yet he wanted him dead without being able to accomplish God's plan of salvation. Satan knew about the plan. Remember when Jesus told Peter that He would have to die and Peter said "No". What was Jesus' reply? "Get behind me Satan!". Jesus knew that Peter could not see the plan and that his desciples respond was prompted by Satan himself, for he did not want the Son of God to be sacrificed in that matter. Thus Jesus' response. Let's also not forget that the suffering Messiah was fortold in the ancient scriptures and I believe you agree with me that Satan knows the scriptures quite well. So again, Satan knew about the plan. Scott [This message has been edited by Scott (edited 23 May 2000).]
posted 05-23-2000 06:52 AM PT (US)

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