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Author	Topic: What does "Haunting" mean to you?

logied Oscar® Winner	I recently bought a score from Australia just because the seller described it as a haunting score. I like haunting scores and took a chance on "The Bridge by Richard G Mitchell. It is a pleasant electronic and orchestra based score with some new age cues and I,m not disappointed that I bought it. It does not come near a haunting score like The Ghost and Mrs Muir or When the Whales Came, two of my favorites. It did raise the question in my mind what is a haunting score and what would that mean to others. What instruments do you consider haunting? The Oboe, Violin, Harpsicord, Muted brass or Therimin. Is it sexy like Body Heat that is haunting or a score like Dracula by Williams that turns you on. Is there romantic haunting and scary haunting and what is the difference?
posted 05-18-2000 03:45 PM PT (US)

Marian Schedenig Oscar® Winner	Doyles Hamlet is haunting. When I play it, I often can't stop playing it again and again for days.
posted 05-18-2000 04:10 PM PT (US)

Marian Schedenig Oscar® Winner	Hm, maybe to me "haunting" doesn't really mean "haunting". It's one of those words which I can't really define translate to German. It has become attached to a feeling for me, but I don't know if "haunting" is really the correct word to describe it.
posted 05-18-2000 04:14 PM PT (US)

Howard L Oscar® Winner	"Haunting" happens to me with a score that I can't keep away from my mind's ear and the whole thing must have to do with something from my past...or maybe it doesn't. I've always felt haunted by the opening bars of the John Williams-arranged piece from the film version of Fiddler On The Roof that goes "Little bird, little Chavala" as well as the closing bars of the song "Funny Girl" from the movie of the same title. Then again, there's Herrmann's score to Twilight Zone's "The Lonely" and a particular passage from Goldsmith's "The Big Tall Wish" that have stayed with me forever, and I sometimes "hear" them while taking a walk late at night. Another very haunting piece of music, though not from film, is Claude Thornhill's "Snowfall".
posted 05-18-2000 05:40 PM PT (US)

Howard L Oscar® Winner	Ah, I'm not satisfied with this last response. 'Specially since I've had some more time to think about it. I mean it only stands to reason that if you focus on the music to a haunting scene then the music's automatically haunting, right? But what if a haunting scene contains music that on its own isn't really "haunting"? I have in mind a climactic moment out of the movie/Alfred Newman's terrific score to The Snake Pit; the DeHavilland character gets a good-bye from an unexpected source. The music underscoring this epiphany is not haunting, per se, but it takes on a truly haunting feel that segues into an even longer and equally haunting cue before things end brightly with an interpolation of the folk hymn "Goin' Home." I'm very thankful that Mr. Newman scored this picture and used this subtle approach, for when I think of the music I see the scene...and it haunts me.
posted 05-20-2000 03:28 PM PT (US)

logied Oscar® Winner	Now I have to see The Snake Pit. I havn,t seen that movie in xx years. Was Mark Stevens in that picture? My minds eye sees him in a white coat. Olivia, another english beauty. She aged better than most. NP The War Lover (not really a soundtrack but a inspired by collection of WWII dance music with the begining title and end title theme from the movie)
posted 05-20-2000 04:42 PM PT (US)

JJH Oscar® Winner	very difficult to describe "haunting." I would apply that term to very few of my scores/ melodies. Though the one that does stand out in my mind as "haunting" would have to be John Corigliano's Revolution. The main theme played on that flute or recorder or whatever it is, is very nice, but half way through the title track, there is a chord change that absolutely ties me in knots. It's very simple, but so effective. It's one of those that I can conjure up in my mind anytime I want to, and not lose a beat, so to speak. It really is about the only thing I could classify as "haunting." Well, maybe Debbie Wiseman's Haunted main theme, as rendered on piano, would work as well. I highly suggest seeking out the bootleg. NP -- Beneath the Planet of the Apes finally came in! woo-hoo! [This message has been edited by JJH (edited 20 May 2000).]
posted 05-20-2000 05:58 PM PT (US)

Timmer Oscar® Winner	I would suggest Vaughan Williams 3rd symphony 'A Pastoral Symphony'. the 2nd movement 'Lento Moderato' with that haunting trumpet solo....for me, it hits on a very deep level, Me and three friends had this playing on a tape once, this track came up,we were camping (out on the Mendip's,a beautiful area in England),it was about 5am in the morning (we were drinking and chatting all night around a camp fire) and there was a white mist settleing inbetween the valley's.....A truly magical moment! If you have this piece of music,try playing it with the scenerio I have just described in mind! NP : The film 'Around Midnight' is on, and I'm listening to it.....very good too!
posted 05-20-2000 06:34 PM PT (US)

S Smith unregistered	To me it means a pretty bad movie with a pretty good score. I think of "haunting" as it might apply to music as sort of dark, brooding, moody; perhaps "scary" but usually with a low-level intensity, evoking either a thriller-type tension, or perhaps a heart-rending passion. NP: John Williams: "Earthquake"
posted 05-20-2000 11:04 PM PT (US)

Marian Schedenig Oscar® Winner	Timmer: We're talking about haunting music, you mention RVW, and no word of the Thomas Tallis fantasia? I don't listen to it often enough, it seems, because I think it is very haunting, but it doesn't haunt me, 'cause I can't remember the music at the moment...
posted 05-21-2000 07:06 AM PT (US)

JJH Oscar® Winner	I guess I could add Chrales Ives' The Unanswered Question NP -- American Beauty, Thomas "I should have won the Oscar" Newman
posted 05-21-2000 08:25 AM PT (US)

Howard L Oscar® Winner	Laurence Rosenthal's entire score to The Miracle Worker is definitely a haunt, as is Copland's climactic finale to Of Mice And Men (1939). Another really nice piece of music was Mr. Horner's underscoring a scene in Field Of Dreams. It's when Doc Graham hears someone yell "Hey Rookie, you were good" before turning around and disappearing into the cornfield. The haunting aspect is that this was the final acting scene of Burt Lancaster's life, too, and that line with the music is some epitaph. PS Logied, Mark Stevens indeed played her husband. [This message has been edited by Howard L (edited 21 May 2000).]
posted 05-21-2000 02:55 PM PT (US)

Timmer Oscar® Winner	Marian, I guess it comes back to, 'define Haunting',It's a personal thing. The Tallis Fantasia is more in that religious vein that Thor loves so much, and as I've stated elsewhere is my all time favorite piece of music!, on reflection I guess it could be described as haunting?! JJ, I love Ives. Wasn't Bernard Herrmann a champion of his music? NP : Shepherd Moon's - Jamie Horner...errr ENYA
posted 05-21-2000 06:06 PM PT (US)

Marian Schedenig Oscar® Winner	quote: Originally posted by Timmer: I guess it comes back to, 'define Haunting',It's a personal thing. The Tallis Fantasia is more in that religious vein that Thor loves so much, and as I've stated elsewhere is my all time favorite piece of music!, on reflection I guess it could be described as haunting?! Yes, I think that's a pretty adequate definition of "haunting" for me. Many Bruckner symphonies are very haunting as well. NP: Donnie Brasco (Doyle)
posted 05-22-2000 10:01 AM PT (US)

JoeInSanDiego Oscar® Winner	For me, personally, "haunting" music is such that invokes tragedy, despair or perhaps a deep, unrequited love. Nino Rota's theme for Romeo and Juliet is haunting, for example, in that it is a gorgeous melody that is steaped in the knowledge that tragedy is inevitable. Often times, woodwinds invoke a "haunting" sound, although strings can be used succesfully, as can the ever-reliable harp. Rarely do ethnic instruments work to produce "haunting" music for me, although I am sure there are exceptions which I cannot think of off the top of my head. Choral work can also be quite effective in this vein, as long as it isn't over the top. I think, by the very nature of it's definition, "haunting" music must be sublime, reflective and intensely personal. Just my two cents. NP - North by Norhtwest (Herrmann) [This message has been edited by JoeInSanDiego (edited 22 May 2000).]
posted 05-22-2000 10:21 AM PT (US)

Luscious Lazlo Oscar® Winner	MEMO TO JJH: You're partially right about THE UNANSWERED QUESTION. It starts out brilliantly with that ethereal descending string section. But then that boring trumpet & those cacaphonous woodwinds come in and shoot everything straight to hell. Ives should've written it solely for the string section. MEMO TO HOWARD: I haven't heard the movie version of FIDDLER ON THE ROOF. And I don't remember "Little Bird, Little Chavala" from the stage-version record. Regarding THE SOUND OF MUSIC, I dig the intro to "Sixteen Going on Seventeen". Rolf sings: "You wait, little girl, on an empty stage, for fate to turn the light on. Your life, little girl, is an open page, that men will want to write on." Have you ever heard a tune called "Mr. Blue" by The Fleetwoods? It's a piece of mellow low-key melancholia. I love the singer. He sings it softly. And he's accompanied by a smooth female chorus.
posted 05-23-2000 06:28 PM PT (US)

JJH Oscar® Winner	Lush Baby! It's the trumpet that MAKES it haunting! To me, the trumpet is asking the eternal question of Life, the Universe, and everything (to quote Douglas Adams) repeatedly, only to be denied. The strings to my mind and ears represent whatever idea of Heaven people hold dear (if you believe in such a notion as Paradise). The trumpet represents mankind, perpetually asking these questions of God, or the deity of your choice. the trumpet's question is seemingly never answered, as it fades into the background of the strings. The Unanswered Question is without a doubt a masterpiece, and my very favorite Ives pieces. Ives was ahead of his time harmonically. Pretty good for a person who sold insurance for a living. Well, that's why I love the piece so much.
posted 05-23-2000 09:16 PM PT (US)

logied Oscar® Winner	Being new to the board I kept thinking that NP meant NEW PURCHASE but it became painfully obvious (and embarassing) to realize it must mean NOW PLAYING. How about a score like The Day The Earth Stood Still, haunting or eriee or both. NP Presumed Innocent by John Williams, its raining outside, deary score for the beginning of a deary day.
posted 05-24-2000 04:30 AM PT (US)

Howard L Oscar® Winner	I was aiming at the instrumental lead-in and closing, not the sung songs themselves, respectively, in Fiddler and Funny Girl. As for Sound Of Music, the instrumental lead-in to "Something Good" as heard in the film would fit here quite nicely. Ditto for the incredibly haunting interlude between "If Ever I Would Leave You" and the piece entitled "Love Montage" on the Camelot soundtrack. Mr. Newman really outdid himself here as arranger/orchestrator/adapter. [This message has been edited by Howard L (edited 24 May 2000).]
posted 05-24-2000 12:25 PM PT (US)

Marian Schedenig Oscar® Winner	quote: Originally posted by JJH: It's the trumpet that MAKES it haunting! It's been way too long since I heard Unanswered Question to remember anything specific, but I DO remember the "feeling" of that trumpet part well enough to agree with you, I think. quote: To me, the trumpet is asking the eternal question of Life, the Universe, and everything (to quote Douglas Adams) repeatedly, only to be denied. Hm. Maybe Ives should have replaced the trumpet by a soprano singing "42"? NP: Symphony #4 (Johannes Brahms; Cleveland Orchestra/George Szell)
posted 05-24-2000 02:50 PM PT (US)

Luscious Lazlo Oscar® Winner	MEMO TO HOWARD: I just heard "Little Bird, Little Chavala". The record refers to it as "Chava Ballet Sequence". Actually, it's a regular tune which is sung by some poor shlub who was unfortunate enough to have been named after a brand of toothpaste. Julie Andrews says: "So somewhere in my youth or childhood, I must have done something good". "Youth or childhood" must have been inspired by The Department of Redundancy Department. I also just heard a brilliant 2-piano piece called "Night Waltz" by Paul Bowles. It's on a record called U.S. CHOICE. Bowles was a genuine mystical genius. I'll never forgive him for abandoning music-writing in favor of fiction-writing.
posted 05-24-2000 05:50 PM PT (US)

pietari Oscar® Winner	I consider most of Chris Ýoung´s quieter works to be haunting especially Haunted Summer. Other good ones are Beyond Rangoon, Preisner´s REquiem for a Friend, The Lake from Jerry´s Lionheart, Main Title from Usual Suspects etc. NP-Requiem for a Friend ***/***
posted 05-26-2000 01:44 PM PT (US)

H Rocco Oscar® Winner	"Andante Cantabile" -- Bernard Herrmann, THE GHOST AND MRS. MUIR "Hospital" -- Jerry Goldsmith, PAPILLON "The Hospital" -- Jerry Goldsmith, PATTON "Main Title" and "Scene D'Amour" -- Bernard Herrmann, VERTIGO the Memory theme -- Akira Ifukube, heard in the first two MAJIN films and GODZILLA VS. KING GHIDRAH main title -- Christopher Young, DREAM LOVER "Marion" and "Marion and Sam" -- Bernard Herrmann, PSYCHO finale -- Fumio Hayasaka, RASHOMON
posted 05-26-2000 01:50 PM PT (US)

Lou Goldberg Oscar® Winner	To call music haunting, I suppose it means something that is not only "beautiful" or emotionally moving but something that literally haunts you, that recurs, sticks in your mind, tingles you, feels spooky and ethereal, that effects your memory the way perfume is supposed to evoke images of the woman associated with it. I've been thrilled by a lot of music, but very rarely moved to tears or spine chills. Some intrumentation seems naturally haunting, solo cellos and bass, Williams' Schindler's List's use of the violin, the resonance of the strings literally vibrating your own chest from the sound. This could be enough on its own, but haunting usually means a haunting melody. Haunting for me is achingly beautiful the main theme to Arnold's David Copperfield which all of you will rediscover when Marco Polo re-records it. Also Michel Legrand's theme from Wuthering Heights, which becomes even more haunting when added to lyrics about love beyond life into eternity. Steiner is a hit and miss composer for me, but his score to Now Voyager has a couple of themes that strike me as haunting--the most so not the main/love theme but a secondary theme or motif that plays over a scene where Bette Davis parts from Paul Henreid at an airport. Then there is Bernard Herrmann's Jennie's Song from the wonderful film Portrait of Jennie--it's actually designed to be a haunting melody because that's its function in the plot of the film! Richard Addinsell composed an amazing beautiful theme to a David Lean film, The Passionate Friends, which I would call haunting. In the same way, I find Princess Leia's theme from Star Wars haunting. Delerue was born to write haunting themes, the main theme from Day of the Dolphin and Muriel's theme from Two English Girls instantly coming to mind. Morricone has wriiten a number of haunting themes too---the TV mini-series Marco Polo containing music of beautiful, mystery, and the exotic, the theme from Bloodline sending chills up my spine every time I hear it. There are more examples of course and what's haunting is personal and subjective to a large degree too. Timmer--Yes, Herrmann was an early champion of Ives. He would visit the aging Ives at his apartment and conducted Ives on CBS radio. There is a London Phase-4 recording of Ives' 2nd Symphony conducted by Herrmann. JJH--I loved your analysis of the Unanswered ? Lush--Maybe you're right about Bowles, but while his music tended to light, even circusy in places, the fiction reveals his true darkness. I don't think Bowles wanted to reveal this viewpoint in his music and took to writing. Of course, maybe he was too busy buggering and smoking kif to read music any longer. Sometime in the 80s, Bowles arrived in NY for a concert of his older music. Pietari--I agree about the hauntingness of Beyond Rangoon and it also answers Joel's query about haunting music coming from exotic, native instruments--it can. NP: Il Prado/The Meadow (Ennio Morricone)---not quite haunting but it will do. [This message has been edited by Lou Goldberg (edited 26 May 2000).]
posted 05-26-2000 09:58 PM PT (US)

Lou Goldberg Oscar® Winner	Oh and Rocco--you are so right about the Marion/Marion & Sam cues from Psycho--they're short and not major to the score but they are so evocative of romantic anguish as to be haunting. In the same vein is Delerue's "love" theme from The Soft Skin/Le Peau Douce, "Pierre et Nicole" I believe it's called, depressing beyond belief. Returning to Bowles, Sakamoto's theme to The Sheltering Sky could be called haunting, his theme to yet another version of Wuthering Heights certainly is.
posted 05-26-2000 10:31 PM PT (US)

H Rocco Oscar® Winner	Thanks Lou. There's always a bunch of others to mention, but in paticular, I should have remembered "Miserere" from Morricone's THE MISSION.
posted 05-26-2000 10:37 PM PT (US)

Howard L Oscar® Winner	"Haunting for me is achingly beautiful..." Double that thanks, Lou. As "Roc" once said in a Star Trek episode, "THAT is the equation!"
posted 05-27-2000 09:09 AM PT (US)

Swashbuckler Oscar® Winner	For someone who has used (and over-used, perhaps) the term as often as I do, it is interesting that I was stymied for several days with this thread trying to define it. There are several quite applicable definitions given by many people, but the bottom line is this... Haunting music is like pornography... ...I know it when I hear it.
posted 05-27-2000 12:55 PM PT (US)

Nicolai P. Zwar Oscar® Winner	quote: Originally posted by Swashbuckler: Haunting music is like pornography... ...I know it when I hear it. You wouldn't know any links? Links to samples of haunting music of course!!! What were you people thinking?
posted 05-27-2000 03:10 PM PT (US)

Marian Schedenig Oscar® Winner	quote: Originally posted by Nicolai P. Zwar: You wouldn't know any links? http://www.moviemusic.com/mb/Forum1/HTML/002636.html Okay, I admit that this was extremely stupid. NP: Te Deum (Anton Bruckner) - Check this out! NOW!
posted 05-27-2000 04:07 PM PT (US)

Lou Goldberg Oscar® Winner	Hey Swashbuckler---since you know it when you hear it, name off some themes you'd consider haunting. And yes, for some reason I thought about this topic for days before answering too. NP: Morning Heroes (Arthur Bliss), an oratorio, not a film score.
posted 05-28-2000 12:53 AM PT (US)

Nicolai P. Zwar Oscar® Winner	quote: Originally posted by Marian Schedenig: Okay, I admit that this was extremely stupid. True. But then, mine was even stupider to begin with.
posted 05-28-2000 03:45 AM PT (US)

Swashbuckler Oscar® Winner	"Vertigo" by Bernard Herrmann (the whole thing) "Upon the King" from "Henry V" by Patrick Doyle Title music from "Les Miserables" by Basil Poledouris "The Herb Garden" from "The Lion in Winter" by John Barry The piano portion of "Andy and Moon's Theme" from "At Play in the Fields of the Lord" by Zbigniew Preisner "Looks Like a Suicide" from "Dances With Wolves" by John Barry The pre-dream sequence from "Laura" by David Raksin "Fahrenheit 451" by Bernard Herrmann (the whole thing) Much of "Alien3" by Elliot Goldenthal The unreleased (damn it!) score from "Waterland" by Carter Burwell "Farewell" from "The Ghost and Mrs. Muir" by Bernard Herrmann The climax of "Barton Fink" by Carter Burwell "Kobayashi's Domain" from "The Usual Suspects" by John Ottman Quite a bit of "The Mystery of Rampo" by Akira Senju "The Story of the Fisher King" from "The Fisher King" by George Fenton Most of "The Shawshank Redemption" by Thomas Newman ...there are more, but it's a hard question to answer...
posted 05-28-2000 12:04 PM PT (US)

Chris Kinsinger Oscar® Winner	This is a wonderful topic, and like Lou & Swashbuckler, I've been reading and reading, while trying to define "haunting". As many of you have already agreed, it's a highly personal feeling. Emotional on one level, spiritual on another. Many of the already mentioned scores would also be on my list, but I'll add two oddballs which haven't yet received notice: Enemy Mine Maurice Jarre's alien chanting at the conclusion of this film always sticks with me for days. Sadly, you cannot ever watch a TV broadcast of this movie because the ending is always butchered. Do your best to see it in widescreen if you can. Joe VS The Volcano This looney fairy tale has a solid heart at its center, and Georges Delerue's magical score captures it wondrously. The love theme truly is haunting. The scene that always touches my heart the most is when Joe (who believes that he's dying) is stranded on a raft on the open sea. The moon rises on the horizon, and it is unbelievably huge. Joe looks into the light of it and speaks, "Oh God!...Who's Name I do not know...I forgot how BIG...Thank you for my life. Thank you for my life..." Makes me bawl like a little girl every time.
posted 05-28-2000 08:33 PM PT (US)

pietari Oscar® Winner	For music to be haunting to me, it in most cases needs a form of soft synth backing with orchestral music coming in at some point and as Lou has pointed out exotic instruments do often help. This can be witnessed in most of my previous choices. A few more I´d like to add: Merlin/jones The last place on Earth/Jones The Sweet Hereafter/Danna Under Fire/Goldsmith Field Of Dreams/Horner Zoya/Poledouris The Thin Red Line/Zimmer NP-Musical Drama/Broughton **/*** The Last place on earth
posted 05-29-2000 02:18 AM PT (US)

Lou Goldberg Oscar® Winner	Chris--you are so right about Joe Vs The Volcano being a practically religious experience, especially that moment with the huge moon on the horizon. His H'ness, the Rocco man, will probably treat you to ice cream for mentioning Enemy Mine, one of the few Jarre scores he loves. Thanks Swash for going into detail....
posted 05-29-2000 09:49 PM PT (US)

Marian Schedenig Oscar® Winner	The opening bars of the Blue Danube Waltz, especially when played at 0:00 on New Year's eve, is probably the most haunting piece of music that I can think of.
posted 05-30-2000 05:08 PM PT (US)

Thor Oscar® Winner	Perhaps this is one of the terms that should go undefined? (<---- look at me chicken out!)
posted 05-31-2000 07:30 AM PT (US)

Lancelot Oscar® Winner	I think "haunting" comes down to two or three notes which hit the ear just right...the way a passage shifts to minor when you think it's going to major, or the presence of a particular instrument that carries a melody, that sometimes is almost hidden within the sweep of the whole passage.
posted 06-01-2000 07:22 AM PT (US)

JClark Oscar® Winner	Marian and Timmer: From a fellow RVW fan, here are a couple of great haunting works by the old maestro. One, a little-known opera called Riders to the Sea (recorded on the Chandos label--the best classical label out there, IMHO), is a beautiful one-act story about Irish seamen drowning in a storm. For that piece, I guess it's the subject matter that generates the "haunting" nature of the music. Flos campi is another beautiful piece by RVW, for orchestra and instrumental choir. Parts of it are echoed rather strongly in the underwater cues of The Phantom Menace soundtrack. It's clearly quite a personal work. In fact, the English seem to know how to write haunting music (I'm not speaking about film scores in particular) better than most. The piece that haunts me more than any other is the aching lament of Elgar's Cello Concerto (1919), which most feel is meant to mourn the loss of the best of pre-war English culture. Marian: What did you make of the Sinfonia antarctica? I prefer the "Pastoral" myself; I also enjoy Bruckner's Te Deum quite well.
posted 06-01-2000 10:40 AM PT (US)

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