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      Mission to Mars: "What's impossible?"

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    Author
    Topic:   Mission to Mars: "What's impossible?"

     James
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    Every so often a film comes along which proves (to me, at least) how little the critics know.

    After hearing so many bad reviews about this movie, many of them citing Morricone's score as a downside, I am confident that most critics have completely lost it.

    I was worried, as many were, that we were going to see another 2001 rip-off, but thankfully this was not so (although there are more than a few homages). The heart of the film is completely different. I laughed, I jumped, I cried; I didn't touch my popcorn. I also really enjoyed the cinematography.

    To make this post more relevant, Morricone's score was definitely a HUGE part of the film. It was absolutely beautiful, and I would buy the CD even if it only had the finale sequence on it. It is absolutely magnificent. I loved it.

    I loved the score, I loved the movie. and judging from the reactions, applause, and after-comments of the SOLD OUT crowd at the theater with me, I am not alone.

    Hope I'm not starting to sound too much like a critic myself...

    James

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    posted 03-10-2000 08:13 PM PT (US)     

     Chris Kinsinger
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    Thank you very much, James!
    I would see this one no matter WHAT any critic has to say, but you have just made me really eager to see it!

    I can't wait!

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    posted 03-10-2000 09:14 PM PT (US)     

     Jim Wynorski
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    I have just come back from a 7pm screening of Mission to Mars, which received horrible notices in today's papers here in Los Angeles. I can't tell you how off they were, in my humble opinion. I felt the film was uplifting, suspenseful, and thought-provoking...and the Morricone score is wonderful...especially the end title. **** the critics!!!

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    posted 03-10-2000 10:07 PM PT (US)     

     Crono/Kyp
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    I liked the movie, thought is was good. Some parts could have been better written but that Hollywood and space for you (2001 dosen't count, that rocked)

    The film was all Brian DePalma, I love his movies. The score was good, nothing I would buy RIGHT NOW, but maybe I'll ask for it for my b-day.

    --Kyp

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    posted 03-10-2000 11:11 PM PT (US)     

     Cole
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    wow
    WOW
    WOW!!!
    the score...oh my god, its full of stars

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    posted 03-11-2000 12:34 AM PT (US)     

     sakman
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    I gave up believing critics after "Eyes Wide Shut" last summer.

    I thought this was an ok film, not warranting the negative reviews of this in the local papers. I guess with no swearing and no nudity it must equal "not a good movie" these days.

    In my humble opinion, the opening 10-15 minutes could be cut. It does not do anything that can't be, or was, revealed later in the film. The finale of the film was great as is the cinematography. A review I read said something about Morricone's score blocking out dialogue, that wasn't my experience, and this was anything but "bombastic". It reminded me more of "Contact".

    If nothing else, I suspect we will be hearing at least the "Theme from MTM" on future "pops" type recordings of sci-fi music.

    This is a movie you could take your 7-8 year old too. It reminded me of when I saw "Damnation Alley" in the theaters (I think I was one of the few..lol).

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    posted 03-11-2000 08:26 AM PT (US)     

     Chris Kinsinger
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    OH NO!
    NOT "Damnation Alley"!

    AAAIIIIIIIEEEEEEEEEEE!!!

    Phoniest giant scorpions in the History of Cinema!


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    posted 03-11-2000 09:20 AM PT (US)     

     Timmer
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    What?, Even phonier than the Spiders in Invasion of the Giant Spiders??

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    posted 03-11-2000 09:31 AM PT (US)     

     Jeron
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    Even more phonier than those found in "Clash of the Titans"?

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    posted 03-11-2000 11:53 AM PT (US)     

     Shaun Rutherford
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    Luckily I went into this film thinking it would be terrible. The first half of the film was so boring that I had trouble focusing my attention on the screen. From the time Tim Robbins gets outside of the ship, it gets good. Not really good, just plain good. That sequence and the one that follows is suspenseful as hell, and Morricone's horn blast really hits you in the gut (if you saw the film, you know what I mean).

    Shaun

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    posted 03-11-2000 01:18 PM PT (US)     

     Dawk
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    I think Morricone's score, by itself might be ok. But for Mission to Mars.. it was inappropriate.

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    posted 03-11-2000 04:00 PM PT (US)     

     John C Winfrey
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    The promo I saw on TV the other night was tracked with music from Stargate, next to last cue on the CD.

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    posted 03-12-2000 10:42 AM PT (US)     

     James
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    Dawk -

    Could you please clarify? I don't intend that to sound like an attack, I'll gladly keep a friendly disagreement, I'm just interested to hear your points and arguments.

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    posted 03-12-2000 11:06 AM PT (US)     

     John Maher
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    If you are a Brian DePalma fan (they don't come bigger than me), you'll love the opening of this film. A great tracking shot, and the most eye popping colors I've seen in a film, since the early 60's. The entire film, is crystal clear (so rare these days), and it contains wonderful production values. I hate outerspace films (Star Wars, 2001, Star Trek, Alien, etc.), so I cannot objectively critique this movie; but I liked it, and my wife loved it. I was less than knocked out by the score (it was quite serviceable, but didn't make me want to run our and get it); but there again, my wife loved the score. Loaded with great DePalma visuals. Go see it!

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    posted 03-12-2000 12:07 PM PT (US)     

     Dawk
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    I'd be happy to clarify. there were a few reasons I felt the music just didn't work. For one, it just sounded out of place, like Brian De Palma was making one movie, and Ennio Morricone was scoring another, and they got swapped at the end. The movie (images and dialogue) was sending me one thing, and the music was sending me something different. I tend to think movie music should work WITH the movie instead of just having whatever the composer decides to put in there, no matter how it worked with the picture. I just don't feel like DePalma and Morricone bothered with spotting sessions or anything like that where they would work out what type of music would work best. I think the biggest gripe of mine was many scenes that I thought were supposed to be tense, or dark, or with some sense of danger should not have such happy music playing.

    -Dawk.

    I hope that helped. my thoughts aren't very organized today, so please forgive me.

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    posted 03-12-2000 02:44 PM PT (US)     

     Bel366
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    I guess I should preface this by stating IMHO. I just saw M2M (no, not the Norwegian pop duo) and thought that all things considered, it was pretty good. I thought that Morricone's score was almost solely responsible at times for any emotion present.
    While I thought that it was pretty good, I think that everyone has to acknowledge the "homages" to other films (CLOSE ENCOUNTERS, 2001, THE ABYSS and even STAR TREK:TMP). Not that it ruined the film for me, I just thought that it was better when it was trying to be MISSION TO MARS and not another film...if that makes any sense.

    I was pleasantly surprised by the score. I felt that though there were some, shall we say, unique ideas, that made it all the more interesting.

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    posted 03-12-2000 04:42 PM PT (US)     

     Sean Bires
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    Don't trust reviews from those trendy, popular-opinionated entertainment magazine critics. Eyes Wide Shut & Mission to Mars recieved good reviews in my newspaper...

    I haven't seen Mission to Mars yet... maybe I'll rent it or something. It doesn't look spectacularly original/unpredictable anyway.

    -Sean Bires

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    posted 03-12-2000 05:19 PM PT (US)     

     James
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    Thanks, Dawk. I understand where you're coming from now.

    James

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    posted 03-12-2000 07:09 PM PT (US)     

     mlw
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    yeah, it's a lovely little film, thoroughly atypical of the sardonic cynic de palma we're used to-- all that warmth and feeling done in a bold way that's honest and true. morricone rocks with an understated paen to human communication-- connections in basic gestures that resonate long after the experience of watching the film. even the requisite de palma suspense set-piece is scored with subtleties. the first quiet space movie in a while, nice open spaces for morricone's complex avant garde-isms.

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    posted 03-12-2000 07:27 PM PT (US)     

     H Rocco
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    Mr. WARE likes it? Awright, I'm sold. I was supposed to see it Friday anyway, but the schedule fell through.

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    posted 03-12-2000 08:19 PM PT (US)     

     Shaun Rutherford
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    Mr. Ware,
    I'm glad you pointed this out. Mission To Mars IS a quiet space movie. I'm extremely pleased at that. Sick of all the bass-y sound effects. The float toward Mars was extremely suspenseful.

    Shaun

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    posted 03-12-2000 09:25 PM PT (US)     

     Cole
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    Allright, now that I have had some time to calm down and think, I want to expand on my views to Mission to Mars. All I posted earlier was that I thought the score was awesome...Which I think it was. It was absolutely beautiful. I do not think, however, that it was right for the film. I thought it was wonderfull but not appropriate. I didn't think a lot of the film was done right. After considering the way in which the film was presented, I have come to the conclusion that I think the film would be great to take your children to. It would be a nice scary dramatic movie for kids. The score definately played to that aspect. it was beautiful and sometimes a bit much...like when there was that typical loud brass blast when Gary Sinese (spoiler?) is in the green house and you see the glimpse of the marooned astronaut behind him. And the finale was exqusite but again was playing to an emotional level that was not supported by the images on screen. Perhaps I am disolusioned but I felt like a different score would have been better...think what it would have been like if Thomas Newman scored it (I dont know for some reason I think a score by him would have been unique and strangely fitting) But, I will go buy the Morricone's soundtrack when it comes out simply because the music was so extremely beautiful and dramatic and will be extremely fun to listen to on its own.
    np - The saint (last track)

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    posted 03-12-2000 10:40 PM PT (US)     

     Al
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    If Thomas Newman had scored it, would there even have been a theme?


    I thought Morricone's score was wonderful and, no matter how odd it became, always fit the images on the screen. Along with such scores as E.T. and Close Encounters, the lengthy, soaring finale made the end of the movie the goosebump-inducing climax that it was.

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    posted 03-13-2000 07:28 AM PT (US)     

     Cole
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    I just cant see this film as being in the same league as such cinematic masterpieces as ET or Close Encounters. And Thomas Newman writes wonderfull themes that are well composed and fit the screen wonderfully. his approach is just more subtle than Morricone's was. Besides...the Newman suggestios was just a "what if?"
    NP - Working Classical (Paul McCartney)

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    posted 03-13-2000 07:42 AM PT (US)     

     John Maher
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    I hated "ET", so yes, I would put "Mission To Mars", in a higher category than that. Not so, "Close Encounters...", though. That film is everything a space related sci-fi film should be...earth bound!

    I agree that the music created a tense mood, throughout much of the film.

    [This message has been edited by John Maher (edited 13 March 2000).]

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    posted 03-13-2000 09:21 AM PT (US)     

     Audacity
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    I don't think the music fit the movie either. I don't have much experience with Morricone but like Dawk said the music did sound out of place to me. It did sound like good music though, I think I will have to see the movie again before I make up my mind.

    Audacity
    NP The Great Escape (Elmer Bernstein)****

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    posted 03-13-2000 11:23 AM PT (US)     

     Al
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    When I referred to ET and Close Encounters, I meant to imply the importance of Morricone's Mission To Mars score and how it heightened the finale to a better level- much like Williams did with the endings to ET and Encounters.

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    posted 03-13-2000 12:43 PM PT (US)     

     joan hue
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    I just went to M2M based on the support in this thread. It is a flawed movie in need of
    tighter direction and editing, and in places a more cohesive script. Still, I was entertained
    most of the time and in places very moved. And loved Morricone’s music. I can see why
    a few people felt places had touches of the sad themes in Once Upon A Time In the West.
    I didn’t feel he just scored tension and the loneliness of space. He is a master at scoring
    human emotions, especially sadness and tragedy, and he beautifully captured those
    emotions. I felt parts were related to the melancholy, elegiac themes from The
    Untouchables.

    I’d have to agree that in a few places, the music didn’t seem to fit the film. I found the
    organ music during one suspense scene grating. Other times, I teared and my throat
    closed not from the movie’s content, but from his lovely almost despondent music. Heroic
    music at the end, and stay to hear the credits...as most filmscore lovers do.

    NP The Classic John Barry ****/*****

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    posted 03-15-2000 06:49 PM PT (US)     

     MattStar
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    I've seen the movie twice now and I loved the quality of the music. It would be really great away from the film. There were a couple of moments where the music didn't seem to really fit what was happening onscreen. But, all in all, I would definitely say that this is the best score that I have heard this year, so far.

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    posted 03-15-2000 08:31 PM PT (US)     

     mlw
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    The music didn't fit the film like a Pavlov drool exercise because that's not what the movie was all about. I know a couple of cues seemed superficially to play against the action but nevertheless followed the emotional gravity of the situation through simplicity and gleaning out the heart of the matter. EM is good at that.

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    posted 03-16-2000 12:49 PM PT (US)     

     robin4
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    Well, I got back from the film and was really not too impressed. The music was okay, I really like it when Woody died. But I didn't like that hole organ part, I thought it was a little annoying. Overall, it was not really something I'd see again. Too bad, it had soo much potential.

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    posted 03-18-2000 09:13 PM PT (US)     

     Lou Goldberg
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    I haven't seen this film yet, but as a rule, I don't take anyone's opinions of a film too seriously. In his letters, Rilke adviced never reading criticism. I may love or hate the film, and I won't know until I see the thing myself.

    Nevertheless, a friend of mine gave this score one of the worse reviews of any film music I've ever heard. He said, that not only did the score call attention to itself and distract from the film, but it "sounded like porno film music."

    NP: A Time To Love and A Time to Die (Miklos Rozsa)

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    posted 03-19-2000 02:11 AM PT (US)     

     Luscious Lazlo
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    Memo to ML Ware: Please stop calling yourself "mlw". I keep mistaking those initials for an abbreviation for "Milwaukee". (And that's enough to send me into a fugue-state of catatonic despair.) You called it: "The first quiet space movie in a while, nice open spaces for Morricone's complex avant-garde-isms." That's an evocative & persuasive sales pitch for the score. (I hope it's as "despondent" as Joan Hue said it is.)

    You also said: "The music didn't fit the film like a Pavlov drool exercise". If any one word sums up the mentality of the entertainment industry, it's "Pavlovian". Which makes me sympathetic to Morricone's anti-mickey-mousing approach.

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    posted 03-19-2000 01:39 PM PT (US)     

     Nicolai P. Zwar
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    I have not yet seen MISSION TO MARS (though I'm going to for sure), but I have heard (and read) the way De Palma talks about Morricone. I am quite sure they did have discussions about the score (and spotting sessions) and it's probably the way it is for a reason. Brian De Palma is a director who is very aware of what a good film score can do and it would be highly unlikely for him to just let this part of movie making take care of itself.

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    posted 03-20-2000 07:36 AM PT (US)     

     Luscious Lazlo
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    http://www.filmtracks.com/titles/mission_mars.html

    CHRISTIAN CLEMMENSEN SAYS: "Overall, this score is all atmosphere and no energy...I found it to be an uninteresting album...Perhaps that's due to my lack of interest in Morricone's drawn-out style, or perhaps his drawn-out style doesn't hold water for me in a sci-fi thriller setting. There's nothing wrong with a contemplative score for such a film, as long as it has some sense of awe about it that lives up to the wonders of space."

    Notice that Clemmensen doesn't judge the music as a separate entity. He judges it in relation to the movie. And he judges it in relation to his own preconception of what outer-space movie-music should sound like. I hate it when critics treat a soundtrack as a mere adjunct of a movie.

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    posted 03-20-2000 08:05 AM PT (US)     

     Andre Lux
    unregistered  


    I agree with you Lucius. I read this review at Filmtracks and found it pretty laughable too. In fact, I don't think you can take seriously a person who can't recognize (or even understand) Morricone's geniality and think "Mission to Mars" is a bad score because, among other things, there isn't any "heroic theme for the astrounats" (sic)...

    I think that's what happens to those who grow up watching things like "Armageddon"!

    LOL!!


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    posted 03-20-2000 08:43 AM PT (US)     

     Andre Lux
    unregistered  


    I had to bring this thread back since "M2M" opened here in Brasil only last friday.
    I loved the movie. It's not a masterpiece by any means, but it's honest and extremely well done.
    The "Sacrifice of a Hero" sequence is breathtaking. Tim Robins is a hell of an actor! And the music, my God!!, the Maestro really knows what he's doing, doesn't he? That last trumpet solos were chilling. When I got home that scene just didn't get out of my mind. I couldn't sleep! You must respect a movie that do it to you...

    The only let down was, of course, the resolution. I'm saying all that cheezy-fussy sequence with the CGI Martian and all the voice-over explanations... Geez! I hate this. Why they need to explain what we are seing on screen?

    I think that's why, in the end, "M2M" ended just as an entertaining flick, while "2001" is a classic.

    Like Terry Gilliam once said: "The difference between 'Close Encounters of the Third Kind' and '2001' is that the end of Kubrick's film is a question, while the end of 'Close Encounters' is an answer - and it's a really silly answer - little kids in latex suites".

    Change "Close Encounter" for "M2" and you'll know what I meant...

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    posted 05-01-2000 07:40 AM PT (US)     

     Thor
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    I saw this film about two weeks ago.

    THE MUSIC

    Morricone has always been a very on/off composer for me. I adore his THE MISSION and spaghetti scores (as does everyone else) but do not agree with his "contemporary" approach to several films (HAMLET, thrillers etc.). M2M falls somewhere inbetween. I certainly agree with joan that the organ music became grating in several sequences and that the music overemphasized certain scenes. On the album (and that's what we should be reviewing), the music was alright, but had a hard time "resoluting" if there is such a term - it builded and builded but never materialized into anything. A mediocre score.

    THE FILM

    Just as John Maher, I love De Palma. Luckily, and as opposed to him, I ALSO love "outer space movies", so this was a double treat for me. The opening scene was terrific - one, long shot to establish the characters, their relations and a general mood, a silence before the (sand) storm.

    The film, just as the music, was plagued by the fact that there was so much POTENTIAL there that never materialized. In other words, there was something wrong with the exposition. Whereas certain scenes and locations seemed rushed and flashed by (such as the spinning space station), others took too long to develop (the mars station). Furthermore, I still feel we should have been WITH THE PROTAGONISTS when we first saw Mars. I sort of felt cheated that there was no JURASSIC PARK-like awe when we first encountered people on Mars. But that's just me and not a critique of the film as such.

    I also found the "alien scenes" rather silly - another case of overstating something onscreen. The audience actually laughed at this. And the CGI wasn't that good to begin with either.

    But all in all, a good film that pleased both the entertainment side of me and the more challenging, intellectual side (to a lesser degree, though).

    SPECIAL NOTE ***incl. SPOILER****:

    The scene where Woody drifts off into space and his wife sends out the life-saving rope is stunning. A real tension-booster and escalator and a magnificent Morricone blast slams us in the face as the rope is JUST SHORT of saving his life and he floats away to meet his destiny. Superb.

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    posted 05-02-2000 08:18 AM PT (US)     

     Andre Lux
    unregistered  


    Hei, Thor first time I agree with everything you said. Except for the "mediocre score" comment, which is perfectly understandable knowing your strange taste for film music.

    Cheers!

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    posted 05-02-2000 02:24 PM PT (US)     
     

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