1. Batman
2. Batman Forever
3. Batman Returns
4. Batman and Robin

and if you include Batman:Mask of the Phantasm, that would be 3.

Why?

Well, the original Batman is simply the greatest superhero score ever, and the only superhero theme that comes close is Superman. Danny Elfman is Batman music, and Tim Burtan is Batman film. Enough said.

Batman Forever, while close as far as film, is a distant second. The theme, while not nearly as good as the original, is okay. However, I like it a lot more than Returns. But Returns is still good. However, B&R is simply the worst. Has Goldenthal ever been this original? I mean, really. It is bad enough that the movie killed the franchise with the WORST actor to done the cape and cowl, but almost every bit of music is a direct copy of Forever. I remember dragging through the movie on opening weekend and thinking, "I wonder if he will ever use new music?" To my dismay, he never did, at least not to my rememberance. Anyway, what are your opinions?

My rankings would have to be:

Batman
Batman Returns
(Batman: Mask of the Phantasme, if included)
Batman Forever
Batman & Robin

I agree with you, robin4, about everything you said about Batman. The best damn superhero score ever! In fact, this is the BEST score ever!

And Batman Returns is one of the best scores ever written, although of course not as good as the original.
And it IS underrated!
The Catwoman theme (Selina Transforms) is the best musical definition of madess since Herrmannīs music for the Psycho-shower scene.

I mention Mask of the Phantasme, because frankly, it doesnīt take much to top that bunch of crap Goldenthal did for the two last movies

So there!

SFT

Sorry, but Superman has that distinction. Always did, always will.

BURN IN HELL PETE M, YOU JERK!!!

(Last part should be taken as a joke)

and Kevin,

Oh, no no my freind, it is I who must beg to differ.
Granted, Superman is a GREAT score, and I love it. But it cannot even be compared to Batman. It simply pales into insignifficance. Itīs like comparing the theme- music from "Jerry Springer" with Psycho.

So you see, Superman WAS the best superhero score ever...but then Batman took over. And I REALLY SERIOUSLY doubt that anyone will top it in our lifetime.

And since I am much smarter than you, Kevin, there will be no further discussion about it.

SFT

NP: My Favorite Martian, John Debney

Superman is more superior than Batman. That's why every composer who scored for the sequels, used John Williams material (which Goldenthal did not for Batman).

But, you're right can't compare those two, wouldn't be fair. I mean, comparing John Williams with Elfmann is like comparing Beethoven to The Backstreet Boys (heheheh)

Anyway, here's my order:

Batman
Batman Returns
Batman: Mask of the Phantasm
Batman Forever
Batman Forever 2 (aka Batman & Robin)

I won't join the Batman/Superman argument. SFT, Scott, I'll just say you're both right.

Jeron & Audacity- I'm not familiar with Blankman, but do you know Doctor Mordrid?

Anyways, ah yes, the Batman scores. Mmmkay--

1)Batman Returns
2)Batman
3)Batman Forever

I dont rate Batman and Robin on the account of it being NEAR identical to the Batman Forever score, and what a pile of sh*t that was. (well, Forver wasnt a BAD score as such, but ack, not Elfman!).

What I meant by that was that it has all the typical ingredients of an action/superhero score, whereas Returns has so much more that is great about it as well as the typical superhero action/stirring theme stuff.

But yes, Batman is a fantastic score, and definitely ranks with Williams' Superman & Goldsmiths' Supergirl as one of the best around.

They are both equally great in my eyes, heck, I even think the movies are both equally great. But another funny thing....Batman the movie had a weaker ending (all the parts PRIOR TO the awesome Bell tolling Batman) and Superman the movie also had a weaker ending (starting from Lex's plans/missile launches).

But back to Batman...

As far as over-all superhero scores go...I haven't heard better than Superman. Next on the list would have to be The Crow by Gabriel Yared. And I know this isn't a score...but Tank Girl is also up there on my list. There were a couple of songs that weren't on the album that should have been, like the animated sequence played when she first aquires her tank...but ahh well.

Interesting points you made. Allow me to respond:

Yes, BATMAN is very "theme oriented", in that the theme shows up in almost every track in some sort of variation. However, one of the most important things in the BATMAN score is exactly that theme, and how Elfman BRILLIANTLY made all those variations on it. I donīt think a composer has ever made better use of a five note motif than that. Just compare The Batman Theme (Main Titles) with Flowers; or First Confrontation with The Bat Cave. Need I say more?
The fact is, that the score NEVER becomes boring, and the only reason one might think so, is after having listened to it three-four million times.
Further more, I must respectfully disagree with you that the score is repetivive, as you imply. First of all, there are great action cues: Roof Fight, Batman To The Rescue, Charge Of The Batmobil and Attack Of The Batwing. Then there are those other quite strange little tracks: Kitchen, Surgery, Face-Off; Flowers, Roasted Dude, The Batcave and The Jokers Poem. Also, there are some other tracks equaly interesting: Love Theme, Clown Attack, Up The Cathedral, Descent Into Mystery...

Hell, the intire score is brilliant. In no way does it have a "weak" beginning as Norman said.

On the the part about the themes:

First of all, the reason why Elfman "onlyī" created the Batman Theme, is that the movie is about BATMAN(!) In this the theme discreibs the darkness and sorrow of the caracter himself. This is also a big part of the Batman Themes mystery: Is it sad, or triumphant? No one can tell for sure.
Second, saying that there maybe should have been a second theme for Bruce Wayn is just plain silly. With the Batman Theme Elfman tells us how Wayn RELLY is...and not what the pretends to be. He shows us WHO Batman/Wayn is. Therefor it is both Batman and Wayns theme. They are certainly not to different caracters. If you think so, then youīve missed the intire point of the movie AND the score.
Second, the reason why Elfman didīnt create a theme for Vicki Vale, is because, she was not an essential caracter, like Batman or the Joker. Sheīs not as interesting or important for the essense of the story. Instead Elfman created a Love Theme for her involvement with Bruce/Batman.
And I must COMPLETELY disagree with you that The Jokers Theme is in anyway "stupid". I actually find that a bit insulting
Elfman created that theme as a waltz because he imagined it as a sick little tune the Joker allways had playing in his head when he got excited. I donīt think I have ever heard a theme wichc fits a carater more perfectly than that. And I donīt see how it could have been different.

And last, there is absolutely NO WAY that the score "could have turned out much better". You canīt perfect perfection!

SFT

About the "weak beginning" subject, personally speaking the score just didn't begin to pick up until "Batman to the Resuce," with the awesome end montage. That theme should have been repeated or a variation should have come up later...despite what Aaron said about being repetitive.

I agree with SFT on the issue that the variations were a strength of the score, but the rest of SFT's argument I don't exactly agree with. Bruce Wayne and Batman are NOT two different people? I don't know about any of you, but I have followed the Batman mythology for quite some time now, and the one thing that I am positive of is that there is really no such person as Bruce Wayne, only Batman, so the question of Wayne and Batman as two different individuals isn't really valid. Disregard the lack of a mask, Bruce Wayne is Batman. Batman is Batman. There really is no Bruce Wayne. His parents' death and his obsession to fight evil drives him to insanity (in a good way...for the innocent) and he becomes Batman, and that Bruce Wayne is the mask, not Batman. Therefore, there wasn't really a need for a Bruce Wayne theme.

Oh yeah, Vicki Vale IS an interesting character and should have gotten more of a theme as opposed to just one short love theme. At least Lois got her share of love themes.

NP - You Only Live Twice (John Barry)

Matt--sorry about that. I guess when you have over 150+ scores it gets hard to remember all the composers! (and that number pales in comparison to some of the other users on here...how do you guys do it?!)

I know, I know I DO take things to personally when it comes to my favorite score. Ah well...

But let me comment on the Love Theme issue once more:

Norman, the reason (I think) that Elfman didīnt give Vicki a theme was because, the story is bascily always seen from either Batman/Wayns or the Jokers perpsective. Being that Vicki is never viewed from any other perspective, the music must therefore show Batmans feelings towards her. The Love Theme is perfect at this. It shows his affection for her, and her affection for him...but it never gives into that "hollywoodish" LOVE THEME thing, because we all know that their relationship can never develope into anything else, due to Wayns alter ego. And the caracters know this aswell. Thus, the music never turns into a fullblown love theme, as we have come to know it.

Itīs not like I think Vicki isīnt an important caracter. But when you think of it, if she had gotten a theme for herself, it just wouldīnt have made sense. At least thatīs what I think.

Do you get my point?

SFT